Hipoint Firearms Forums > Other Topics of Interest > 2nd Amendment > Biden: Obama prepared to take executive action on gun control

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-21-2013, 08:22 PM   #241
Baron_Ottomatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Garland, TX
Posts: 263
Liked 125 Times on 79 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vick1000 View Post
Not if we are allowed hi-cap, semi-auto firearms. That's the point.
David Koresh had lots of high-capacity, semi-auto (and perhaps full auto) firearms but lacked public support. How'd that work out?
__________________
Baron_Ottomatic is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-21-2013, 08:34 PM   #242
willieh
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Castle Rock, Colorado
Posts: 650
Liked 66 Times on 46 Posts

Default

They're not high capacity, they're normal capacity.

willieh is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-22-2013, 05:26 PM   #243
vick1000
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
vick1000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: FL
Posts: 1,556
Liked 158 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
David Koresh had lots of high-capacity, semi-auto (and perhaps full auto) firearms but lacked public support. How'd that work out?
It worked out exactly the way Janet Reno wanted it to work out. Koresh made the mistake of trying to negotiate with the feds, and playing at being a prophet. Why have the weapons, if when your prophecy is fufilled, you then try to talk your way out of it. The Davidians were a commune playing at seperatists, things have changed since then. The public IS being convinced, and that's why the media is using events recently to counter the "revolution".

The people you are trying to convince, will never be swayed. If they cannot grasp the concept of defending liberty from tyranny, we don't need them.
__________________
vick1000 is offline  
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-22-2013, 07:53 PM   #244
Baron_Ottomatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Garland, TX
Posts: 263
Liked 125 Times on 79 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Of what exactly do you believe the public IS being convinced and what is your evidence of this revolution? Barack Obama's resounding defeat in his attempt at reelection? The massive on-going public outcry over the federal government exceeding the limits on its power defined in the Constitution?

When your attitude toward people who don't agree with you 100% is, "F@#k you and the horse you rode in on," you'd better get used to losing political battles.

An assault weapon ban and a ban on magazines larger than 10 rounds will become law - unless enough of the public makes it clear to Washington they don't want it to happen. I don't care what a person's motivation or underlying philosophy for opposing new gun laws might be. If they're willing to add their voice to the chorus of people opposing new restrictions then I want them on my side.

Because once a law does get passed there are no guarantees with the courts.

Our best defense against tyranny is to build a large enough coalition of voters to elect leaders who respect the Constitution. That will never happen with demands for ideological purity.

But then again, I prefer winning the war than dying in a glorious losing battle.

__________________
Baron_Ottomatic is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2013, 12:30 AM   #245
vick1000
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
vick1000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: FL
Posts: 1,556
Liked 158 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
Of what exactly do you believe the public IS being convinced and what is your evidence of this revolution? Barack Obama's resounding defeat in his attempt at reelection? The massive on-going public outcry over the federal government exceeding the limits on its power defined in the Constitution?

When your attitude toward people who don't agree with you 100% is, "F@#k you and the horse you rode in on," you'd better get used to losing political battles.

An assault weapon ban and a ban on magazines larger than 10 rounds will become law - unless enough of the public makes it clear to Washington they don't want it to happen. I don't care what a person's motivation or underlying philosophy for opposing new gun laws might be. If they're willing to add their voice to the chorus of people opposing new restrictions then I want them on my side.

Because once a law does get passed there are no guarantees with the courts.

Our best defense against tyranny is to build a large enough coalition of voters to elect leaders who respect the Constitution. That will never happen with demands for ideological purity.

But then again, I prefer winning the war than dying in a glorious losing battle.
The public is being convinced that the federal government no longer represents the citizens that impowered it. That the elected officials no longer represent those that elected them. The majority? No. But the majority were no in favor of creating this Republic to begin with. My evidence? Running gun sales for the last five years, the growth of the "prepper" movement, the Tea Party demonstrations, the demonstrations held just yesterday all over the country.

You will never convice a fool who fears firearms, and believes the government can and should, protect them from harm, that firearms are a necissary evil. If the simple fact that the only defense of liberty is an armed populace is unacceptable to them, they are lost. No other arguement will convince them, for it is the very reason the 2nd amendment exists, and it's what protects the 1st.

I know this for fact, because when put to the point, they ignore it. Time and time again, you make your point to them, and they ignore it. They are willing to sacrifice MY freedom and security, for imagined security from the occasional lunatic in a shopping mall.
__________________
vick1000 is offline  
2
People Like This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2013, 12:41 AM   #246
dodge
Hi Point Fanatic
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
dodge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: westland,usa
Posts: 1,391
Liked 147 Times on 130 Posts
Likes Given: 153

Default crazy craigslisters.... tampa, swaga got any friends in tampa : )

use your best judgement
http://tampa.craigslist.org/pnl/pol/3536847448.html

(looks like it originated here)
http://www.whatdoesitmean.com/index1643.htm

OBAMA HIT MEN ARE GOING ACROSS THE COUNTRY (Progressive Slayer)


TIME TO ACT INSTEAD OF REACT... OBAMA HIT MEN ARE GOING ACROSS THE COUNTRY... BE CAREFUL... BE AWARE

Obama Death Squads Kill Top Gun Activists As New Massacre Fears

A new report updating their 4 January "urgent action" memorandum to President Putin circulating in the Kremlin, today, states that the "death squads" unleashed upon America by President Obama have claimed their first two victims and warns that "another massacre" in the United States is "much nearer than first believed."

As we had previously detailed in our 5 January report "Obama Death Squads Fan Out Across America As Rebellion Looms" Obama, emboldened by recent US Federal Court rulings giving him absolute authority to kill anyone he chooses in secret, and for whatever reason he deems necessary, dispatched at least 800 VIPER Teams (Visible Intermodal Prevention and Response Teams) throughout America in a bid to assassinate and neutralize any and all opposition to his planned seizure of his citizens guns.

According to this chilling FSB report, the first two Obama "death squad" victims identified by Russian intelligence sources were gun rights activists John Noveske [first photo right] and Keith Ratliff [2nd photo right], both of whom were hailed as supporters of the US Constitutions Second Amendment which grants Americans the right to bear arms.

Western news sources confirming these assassinations report that Noveske was killed after a mysterious single car accident and that Ratliff was killed by a mysterious single gunshot to his head.

Noveske, this report continues, was the owner of Noveske Rifleworks, one the premier makers of what are called assault-style weapons and equipment in the US and which have been specifically targeted by the Obama regime for confiscation.

Ratliff, this report says, was a business partner at FPSRussia (FPS-First Person Shooter), YouTube's ninth most popular channel with more than three million active subscribers and a combined half billion views, and sole owner of FPS Industries, which works in customized weaponry and world leader in military technology.

The Obama regimes reason(s) for assassinating two such high profile weapons manufacturers and gun rights activists, this report notes, is based upon the United States successful reign of terror against top scientists, which between the dates of 2004-2012 have seen 119 of some of the worlds leading researchers mysteriously murdered over US government fears of their reporting the truths of what they've discovered.

By assassinating Noveske and Ratliff, FSB intelligence analysts in this report say, the Obama regime is sending a "chilling message" to all who oppose their plan to totally disarm the American people that they "will stop at nothing" to see their master plan implemented.

Even worse, this report warns, is "new evidence" coming from the United States that the Obama regime is planning another "mass carnage" type event to occur within the next few weeks to bolster their spurious claim that Americans need to be disarmed.

Following in the wake of the 14 December 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School Massacre, top FSB intelligence social psychologists state in this report, the Obama regime will undoubtedly be able to achieve a critical mass of public opinion advocating for new draconian gun laws that will, in essence, make criminals out of millions of otherwise law abiding American citizens.

Unfortunately for the Obama regime, this report says, and the reason for another "tragic event" needing to happen, is that the "official story" about the Sandy Hook Massacre, like nearly all such events before it, is beginning to break down in the light of critical scrutiny and analysis.

One such analysis that has spread widely among American dissident factions was done by Florida Atlantic University professor James Tracy, who in two reports, The Sandy Hook Massacre: Unanswered Questions and Missing Information and Sandy Hook School Massacre Part II: Continued Ambiguity and Augmented Realities clearly shows this tragic event more resembling an intelligence agency/military psychological operation than a lone gunman massacre it is be purported to be.

To the American people being allowed to know the truth of these events it appears unlikely as the Obama regime has secured for itself the lapdog services of the powerful American mainstream propaganda media establishment which, to date, continues to spread its venomous lies to an unsuspecting public not really knowing, or even caring, about the abyss they are being led to.

One such example of this was last month when the CIA-backed social media site FACEBOOK suspended an account because they dared to post a quote by the father of Indian independence Mahatma Gandhi (1869-1948) that said: "Among the many misdeeds of British rule in India, history will look upon the Act depriving a whole nation of arms as the blackest."

also found here...
http://thecaptiansquarters.blogspot.com/2013_01_06_archive.html

__________________
~fall down seven times, get up eight~taoist proverb




"...can't stop stupid sir, i can only slow it down...."


)))NRA Member For Life(((
dodge is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2013, 01:20 AM   #247
Baron_Ottomatic
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Garland, TX
Posts: 263
Liked 125 Times on 79 Posts
Likes Given: 7

Default

Vick, I hope you don't think I'm just being argumentative here because I do pretty much agree with you.

That said, all the evidence you cite didn't stop Barack Obama - a man who does not share our beliefs on the intent of the 2nd Amendment - from being reelected. Unless it results in victory at the ballot box it's not going to ensure our rights are preserved.

Which is why I count myself among the "We Are Doomed" camp. The government can't spend money it doesn't have forever, and over the next few years as entitlement spending balloons the whole charade will collapse. At that point it won't be the tyranny of government from which we'll need defending it will be the tyranny of the mob.

We need allies in this fight, so if someone isn't receptive to defense of liberty against tyranny then we need to find an argument that does appeal to them. It's on us to bring them to our side, not on them to accept defense of freedom on a take it or leave it basis.

I try to look at this from a practical standpoint because in reality the Constitution only means what the Supreme Court interprets it to mean. Four more years of Obama followed by eight years of Biden or whoever stacking the Court with justices that eschew an originalist view of the Constitution and who knows what rights are up for grabs. Other than the right to an abortion at the taxpayers' expense, of course.

If our anger and frustration don't translate into votes we'll only find ourselves angrier and more frustrated in the future.

__________________
Baron_Ottomatic is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2013, 04:39 AM   #248
vick1000
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
vick1000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: FL
Posts: 1,556
Liked 158 Times on 101 Posts
Likes Given: 6

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
Vick, I hope you don't think I'm just being argumentative here because I do pretty much agree with you.

That said, all the evidence you cite didn't stop Barack Obama - a man who does not share our beliefs on the intent of the 2nd Amendment - from being reelected. Unless it results in victory at the ballot box it's not going to ensure our rights are preserved.

Which is why I count myself among the "We Are Doomed" camp. The government can't spend money it doesn't have forever, and over the next few years as entitlement spending balloons the whole charade will collapse. At that point it won't be the tyranny of government from which we'll need defending it will be the tyranny of the mob.

We need allies in this fight, so if someone isn't receptive to defense of liberty against tyranny then we need to find an argument that does appeal to them. It's on us to bring them to our side, not on them to accept defense of freedom on a take it or leave it basis.

I try to look at this from a practical standpoint because in reality the Constitution only means what the Supreme Court interprets it to mean. Four more years of Obama followed by eight years of Biden or whoever stacking the Court with justices that eschew an originalist view of the Constitution and who knows what rights are up for grabs. Other than the right to an abortion at the taxpayers' expense, of course.

If our anger and frustration don't translate into votes we'll only find ourselves angrier and more frustrated in the future.
There are far more elections for offices than just the POTUS. The POTUS office is the most glorified and dominated by the media. Try starting with your local councel mambers and sherriff, then move on to your state legislature. You can already see the impact in the states as they stand against the gun grabbing. Get you head out of the sand and turn off your TV, forget Obama. He is the symptom a much larger disease, and the cure starts with you and I in the ballot box.

Catering to their nonsense only makes the disease grow. Let it be localized to their nerve centers like NY, let them live in their crime infested cesspools like Chicago. They will never win, because the patriots have awoken to their schemes, and are standing up to fight back. We are winning despite their best effort to dismay the swing voters with media hype. It's not working, that's why they have ramped up coverage of every gun crime in the country, with the full knowledge it creates more by way of copycats looking for their 15 minutes of fame.

The Supreme Court has already ruled what the 2nd amendment means, we just have to make our government abide the ruling.
__________________
vick1000 is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-23-2013, 08:24 PM   #249
ajole
Feedback Score: 1 reviews
 
ajole's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: NE Utah
Posts: 16,762
Liked 3987 Times on 2812 Posts
Likes Given: 3570

Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
I treat them as separate issues because this is at its heart a political issue. As much as I'd like to make it about God-given natural rights and resistance to tyranny the reality is that those rights can be infringed if there is sufficient public support to do so.
No they can't. Not if this is to stay the America that was founded in 1776, it can't.

If the public decides to do that, the rest of us, who remember what this country was founded on, will have to make a serious choice. It might involve breaking things, to say the least.

And THAT is what the sheeple need to be made to understand. Now, if they TRULY understand that, and majority is willing to go there, then all right, let the chips fall. But I guarantee you, in my AO, the majority would not stand for that. I would almost bet that, outside of the 20-25 major metro areas, most Americans will not stand for that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
We're just one Supreme Court justice away from a liberal majority. If the Dems hold the White House for eight or twelve more years the Court may be split 7-2 between liberal and conservative justices. How would the 2nd Amendment hold up then?
It wouldn't, in which case, neither would America, which is what I tried to tell everyone pre-election last year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
You can give an anti-gun person the real reason the 2nd Amendment exists till you're blue in the face, if they're anti-gun you're not going to change their mind. When it comes to gun rights, they are indeed the problem. They're anti-gun and are therefore inclined to take guns away from people. Explaining the Founding Fathers' original intent for including the 2nd Amendment in the Bill of Rights won't make them not want to take guns away from you.
No, but it will explain why their country is being ripped apart. And it will put an end to the idiotic request that we have a "rational" debate about gun control, when their "rational" arguments are NOT the actual arguments, at all, but statistically insignificant red herrings; and they insist that my rational arguments are crazy talk. I will not look for a "valid" argument to fight their BS, my valid argument is simply the truth.

And does not include Hitler.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
They're also a problem because they, like you, can vote. Maybe five or six times if they're in Chicago or Philadelphia.
I love it. Funny (and sad) because it is true.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
Like every other contentious issue, gun control has relatively fixed and equal numbers of true believers on both sides. It is pointless and irrelevant to try and convince those people to change their minds. What is important, again like every other contentious issue, is to convince the squishy middle to join your side when it comes time to vote.
Agreed. Except for the fact that I'd rather change their minds with the truth, than get them to accept BS, as they want me to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
As much as I agree with you on the intent of the 2nd Amendment, I don't believe "I need to defend myself against government tyranny" will persuade people who don't have strong opinions on gun rights to join our side. As edifying as it may be to discuss it on a site dedicated to guns, it would be viewed as kooky on a site dedicated to cats or cooking or woodworking or anywhere else gun control comes up and people don't already agree with your basic philosophy on gun rights.
Not agreed. They need to understand that our gun rights are NOT about hunting, or SD, or targets. It is ONLY about our founding fathers trying to ensure that a future gov't didn't lapse into the same way of doing business as King George used, and that is NOT up for discussion, or limitation, period. If they don't like it, they can try to use political means to change it...at which time many of us will use the same techniques employed by our founding fathers to correct the situation. Because the FACT is, our rights are OURS, not given by the government, they exist because we do. And any gov't that tries to change that, majority vote or not, is inherently corrupt, and MUST be replaced; and those that support that corrupt government will suffer the consequences.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
In the aftermath of twenty kids killed in a school shooting the other side can play on people's fears by focusing on the scary assault rifle and 30 round magazines the murderer used. Do you honestly believe that the low interest voter who's horrified by the killings and thinks the government should do "something" is going to listen to someone who starts lecturing them on defense from government tyranny?
No, but they will understand it later, as things disintegrate around them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron_Ottomatic View Post
We need to fight smart if we're going to win the war.
Fighting smart doesn't work when you are fighting large groups of stupid people, being driven by years of evil but just smart enough manipulation.
__________________


He who smiles last....

......................thinks slowest.

Q

Not anything to do with me,...but SWAGA referred me to it...and it is pretty funny: The Ballad of Ajole
17 HP's and counting.
ajole is offline  
Dreamthief Likes This 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-24-2013, 03:49 AM   #250
willieh
Feedback Score: 0 reviews
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Castle Rock, Colorado
Posts: 650
Liked 66 Times on 46 Posts

Default

http://www.secretsofthefed.com/military-man-removed-from-obamas-inauguration-for-holding-distressed-flag/
__________________
http://30rar.myfastforum.org/index.php
willieh is offline  
 
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply


Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
McChrystal says ‘serious action’ needed on gun control tallbump 2nd Amendment 12 01-09-2013 01:58 PM
Chris Matthews: Obama will Address, try to Increase Gun Control in the Near Futu adam 2nd Amendment 5 02-07-2011 05:21 AM
Executive Order -- Amending Executive Order 12425 GunMonkey 2010 14 03-05-2010 03:20 PM
Executive Order -- Amending Executive Order 12425 GunMonkey 2010 3 01-08-2010 10:57 PM
President Obama supports an international treaty creating sweeping gun control adam Vintage Topic Archive (Oct - 2009) 12 05-09-2009 03:23 AM

Hi-Point and other models are copyrighted and trademarked to Hi-Point Firearms and MKS Supply. Hipointfirearmsforum.com is not in any way associated with Hi-Point Firearms or MKS Supply LLC