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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I'm retrofitting my AR retro with period correct parts. This includes the complete lower receiver, bolt carrier group and charging handle. I've already got a spare upper receiver.

Recently got a little more stuff to kickstart a new build.

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20" BHW bull barrel
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
After I went to pick up the new slab side lower from the FFL, came home and immediately started tinkering with the retro.

Pulled the buttstock off and put the BCG and charging handle in an upper receiver.

Needs furniture.
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I really think you will like the 25-45 Sharps. I kind of wish I had not converted mine to 6.5 Grendel.

There are 3 faults with the 25-45 Sharps, all of which are well documented and is likely the reason that it's not more popular today.

1st, the cartridge case is too long to accept spitzer bullets much longer than the 87 grain. The longer bullets seat so deep to remain within magazine length that the olgive enters the case mouth. There is a wildcat to correct this. Basically the 25-45 with a shorter case. Powder capacity remains the same because of bullet intrusion into the 25-45 case.

And, it needs all the barrel it can get to reach published velocities, which are taken out of 24" barrels. With the 16" -18" barrels velocity is 200 to 300 fps slower.

3rd, it's not very accurate. it is basically a 2 moa cartridge. that is good enough, I just wanted better. I never did break the 1" group mark at 100 yards.
 

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I really think you will like the 25-45 Sharps. I kind of wish I had not converted mine to 6.5 Grendel.
Why? Are you not getting better accuracy with the 6.5 x 39 Grendel rifle over the 25-45 Sharps? Which round is also more common? I am guess 6.5 x 39 but I could be wrong.
 

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Why? Are you not getting better accuracy with the 6.5 x 39 Grendel rifle over the 25-45 Sharps? Which round is also more common? I am guess 6.5 x 39 but I could be wrong.
I am getting better accuracy with the 6.5 Grendel. 1/2" to 3/4" groups. The 25-45 shot groups twice as big. And the 6.5 Grendel is definitely more popular.

My dislike is not for the 6.5 Grendel cartridge, matter of fact I like the cartridges based on the x39 case. I think they are inherently accurate despite the reputation the AK has. Look at the PPC cartridges, or the 7.62x39 itself out of a goog bolt rifle.

My dislike is for the cartridge in the AR Platform. Stems from my time in the armory at my reserve unit. The AR is designed around the 5656x45 and it's head size. AR bolts are a wear item. They break and are meant to be replaced. The weak spot so to speak. The larger the case head, the larger the bolt face. The larger the bolt face, the more prone to breakage.

It's as simple as that.
 

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....matter of fact I like the cartridges based on the x39 case. I think they are inherently accurate despite the reputation the AK has. Look at the PPC cartridges, or the 7.62x39 itself out of a good bolt rifle.
Bloke on the Range did a video, shooting a newly delivered non zeroed SKS, on the 300 meter Swiss range. Thing shot under 3 MOA, and closer to 2 MOA. He was using Barnaul and IIRC Privi Partisan, so not military surplus stuff.

I'm hoping my bolt hangs on for a while in my AR47, but if it doesn't, I still have the Saiga, the 4 SKS's and the stupid AK.
 

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How many rounds will you get out of a 6.5 x 39 Grendel AR-15 bolt Greg?

I would just save up and buy a spare bolt. They are about $130 correct?
 
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How many rounds will you get out of a 6.5 x 39 Grendel AR-15 bolt Greg?

I would just save up and buy a spare bolt. They are about $130 correct?
I have a spare bolt. And mine has not broken yet. Maybe the deeper face of the Grendel II helps. Still, I have replaced too many bolts in the M16A2 to know that they break.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
1st, the cartridge case is too long to accept spitzer bullets much longer than the 87 grain. The longer bullets seat so deep to remain within magazine length that the olgive enters the case mouth. There is a wildcat to correct this. Basically the 25-45 with a shorter case. Powder capacity remains the same because of bullet intrusion into the 25-45 case.
I'm seeing successful load data with 100 gr bullets.
 

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I'm seeing successful load data with 100 gr bullets.
I am sure you can find some 100 grain bullets that will work. I just never did. The Hornady 117 grain round nose did work, (it's a pretty short bullet about the length of 90 grainers) but I was disappointed in the performance. Now I am in 300 BLK territory. SRC sells a 100 grain Swine Smasher that I have heard good things about, but I never tried them. They are pretty cylindrical bullets.

Here are a few of the light weight, long olgive bullets I tried that did not work.
  • 75g Hornady VMAX
  • 87g Speer TNT
  • 90g Sierra. BlitzKing

None of the 100 grain and up bullets I had on hand worked, except for the 117 grain round nose.

This is from Sharps.

"But we discourage loading bullets heavier than 87 grains. Bullets of 117-120 grains have a steep ogive, which do not provide a good "neck weld" in the chamber. Plus you lose significant powder capacity in the case with heavier bullets. The .25-45 Sharps, at reasonable distances, offers killing power and respectable velocity. But it is not a long range cartridge.
We load our factory ammo with a maximum OAL of 2.250" in order for it to fit in the magazine of an AR...

...The Ramshot X-Terminator powder comes the closest of all of the commercial powders we've tested to the velocities achieved with our factory loadings in which we use factory OEM powders.
We have heard from some shooters who have found that AA2250 yields promising results, but we have not yet tested it."

I never tried the Ramshot powder. I used mostly H335 and RL-7. A bit of IMR 4198.

Here is some of my data. My best loads. Groups are 5 shots
  • Sierra 87 grain, H335, 2725 FPS, 1.25"
  • Speer 87 grain, H335, 2655 FPS, 1.35"
  • Sierra 70 grain, H335, compressed, 2890 FPS, 1.25"
My barrel was from SRC. 20" with a 1:10 twist IIRC. It had a very long throat. COAL was determined by magazine length. Longer cartridges could be singly loaded.

I never could get the velocity Sharps claimed. And I used their data.
 
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Sounds like a fun HandiRifle round. Except then, why cripple it with short brass? May as well go 25-06 if you want a good quarter bore, TONS of loads available then.

It’s like the 300 BO, where the milspec mag and 5.56 bolt head limit things.

I’m thinking people should get more excited about the 6.5 lb POF Revolution .308 AR. All the benefits of the larger mags, with the advantage of the lighter AR15. Of course, the bolt head is an AR15 size with super thin walls to allow for a .308 case to fit. Not sure why I can’t find tons of issues about that.
 

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I have a spare bolt. And mine has not broken yet. Maybe the deeper face of the Grendel II helps. Still, I have replaced too many bolts in the M16A2 to know that they break.
I qualified with an M-4, and the bolt broke at some point during the process. I had no idea it had happened until I tore it down to clean it afterwards. With so many lugs on the bolt, when one breaks off, the rest lest it keep locking well enough, apparently. It's just a good thing that the broken bolt lug left the receiver when it came off.
 

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Sounds like a fun HandiRifle round. Except then, why cripple it with short brass? May as well go 25-06 if you want a good quarter bore, TONS of loads available then.

It's like the 300 BO, where the milspec mag and 5.56 bolt head limit things.

I'm thinking people should get more excited about the 6.5 lb POF Revolution .308 AR. All the benefits of the larger mags, with the advantage of the lighter AR15. Of course, the bolt head is an AR15 size with super thin walls to allow for a .308 case to fit. Not sure why I can't find tons of issues about that.
When I was bigger in the Handi Rifle than I was today, that's pretty much the philosophy that I had. Why 308 when you can get a 30-06 with no change in any dimensions of the rifle?
I did get a 223 and a 308 though, along with a 45/410, but simply because they were the only game in town for the Survivor.

Personally I think the 300 H'AMR is probably the ultimate cartridge for the AR Hunter as it retains all the critical specs of the platform and will handle most of the available .308 bullets. It would be neat to see a family of cartridges based on the 300 H'AMR, from 6mm on up.
 

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Personally I think the 300 H'AMR is probably the ultimate cartridge for the AR Hunter as it retains all the critical specs of the platform and will handle most of the available .308 bullets. It would be neat to see a family of cartridges based on the 300 H'AMR, from 6mm on up.
What's the trade off on range though?
 

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What's the trade off on range though?
Between the 25-45 Sharps and the 300 H'AMR? I don't think it would be much, if any. The Sharps starts out 200 + FPS faster but it likes short stubby bullets . The H'AMR using a 150 grain bullet has a much higher BC than what the Sharps 87 grain bullet has. That heavier slower bullet will retain its velocity better. They both likely perform best out to 200, maybe 250 yards. I am willing to bet the 300 H'AMR will be more accurate to boot.

be nice to see the two cartridges head to head.
 

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Between the 25-45 Sharps and the 300 H'AMR? I don't think it would be much, if any. The Sharps starts out 200 + FPS faster but it likes short stubby bullets . The H'AMR using a 150 grain bullet has a much higher BC than what the Sharps 87 grain bullet has. That heavier slower bullet will retain its velocity better. They both likely perform best out to 200, maybe 250 yards. I am willing to bet the 300 H'AMR will be more accurate to boot.

be nice to see the two cartridges head to head.
I quoted specifically for the 300, but still good all around Intel. I think I'll stick with the .308. It's one thing to know I'm going to reach out to 800y which means I'm bringing the 30-06. It's another thing to know I can stretch my .308 to 800y even if the plan is to keep it under 400y.
 
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
The barrel is finally in St Louis. Maybe I’ll have it in today’s mail.

The rifle won’t be complete until at least some time early next month.
 

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My dislike is not for the 6.5 Grendel cartridge, matter of fact I like the cartridges based on the x39 case. I think they are inherently accurate despite the reputation the AK has. Look at the PPC cartridges, or the 7.62x39 itself out of a goog bolt rifle.

My dislike is for the cartridge in the AR Platform. Stems from my time in the armory at my reserve unit. The AR is designed around the 5656x45 and it's head size. AR bolts are a wear item. They break and are meant to be replaced. The weak spot so to speak. The larger the case head, the larger the bolt face. The larger the bolt face, the more prone.
The x39 in the AR platform jams..........blah-blah-blah. Well, it was a mag issue. So there are mags out there that work fine now.

The bolt issue. Young MFR has a better designed bolt with additional "meat" where it's needed. I think LMT has their design too.

Bolt MFR's went to build them with existing 5.56 parts aka as cheap as possible.

I would like to see the HMB design for the x39. Young builds 5.56 bolts under license. Not for the x39. The cam pin hole is a frequent failure point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Dry fit the barrel a couple of days ago. Will order some furniture next week.

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The OD Hogue grip was a gift.
 

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.308 Winchester is so common compared to the .300 H’AMR ammo which I doubt with ever even get near as popular as .300 Blackout or 6.5 x 39 Grendel. I wish now I would have went with an AR-15 in 7.62 x 39 over .300 Blackout even though I really like .300 Blackout. I can always get a 7.62 x 39 AR-15 upper assembly in the future and shoot both cartridges.

AR-15 rifle parts are far more common for .300 Blackout over 7.62 x 39 AR-15 parts, but ammo for 7.62 x 39 is about as common as .308 Winchester.
 
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