Adding a silencer...

Discussion in 'Vintage Topic Archive (Sept - 2009)' started by Taurus357, Mar 8, 2008.

  1. What all is involved? I have read lots of things on the topic. Here's what I've read, please let me know what is true and what is not...

    $200 stamp for the silencer
    $200 stamp for the rifle is silencer is removable


    Any/all of this true? Kinda like the idea...
     
  2. As far as my knowledge goes on class III type stuff you pay the $200 tax for the silencer, and go through all the paper work and thats it. I have never heard of having to pay an additional $200 for "$200 stamp for the rifle if silencer is removable" all silencers when you buy them are removable aren't they ? I dunno since I have never bought one primarly because of the paper work I'm probably not of much help, but jus my 2 cents worth.
     

  3. Kagern

    Kagern Guest

    Find suppressor.
    Put deposit on suppressor (most places).
    File Form 4, with:
    --- Passport photo
    --- 2 fingerprint cards
    --- $200
    --- Signature from local CLEC (Sheriff, Chief of Police, Judge, etc) that states they have no reason to believe you will using it to shoot up a bunch of little kids.
    Wait up to 6 months.
    Pick up suppressor.
    Shoot.
    Smile.

    The only reason you'd ever have to pay the $200 transfer again was during a sale to someone without a Class 3 SOT (them or you). If they have a Class 3, they file the Form 4 and don't have to pay the transfer tax (they pay a couple grand every year for the privilege). Of course, if you sell it to a non-Class 3 dealer, without having a Class 3 yourself, you spend the next ten years being fine upstanding citizens girlfriend.
     
  4. griff30

    griff30 Member

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    He's right Taurus.
    Also you may put said silencer in a trust for your kids and they don't have to pay a tax if inherited. Funny huh?
    Also you CAN BUILD YOUR OWN if you fill out a form 1. AT NO COST.
    So $200 for a can if you buy it or build it.

    There is more info if you call the BATFE they will explain it all.
    You must ALSO be in a state where it's legal. If your from California, don't even ask.
    There is a VERY helpfull forum here http://www.silencertests.com/ that boasts that they pull less posts than anyone. They are helpfull in building one if you want to save $500 on a can you wont use as much as you think you will.
    Me I would pay the tax and build one.
     
  5. You're lucky you can own silencers. In MI its a no-no as are SBR's. Hopefully one day we can own them. We can own full-autos and AOW's thankfully.
     
  6. I asked one of the class III dealers here about it a few months ago. If I buy one and pay tax & fees, its going to be about $800. If I pay the tribute to the mighty gov and do it myself it would cost less, depending on what I chose to build. Never mind--I decided to put the money in more guns & ammo!
     
  7. 800 dollars? Dang thats a lot of money for a can.

    Why the big draw to cans anyway?

    I can own one (but can't legally put a bullet though it in this state though) but never really cared to own one.
     
  8. OK, so I have a couple of questions on this subject.

    One, if I understand it correctly, I can get a stamp and then make one (not for sale) and its all legal and good? Is this correct?

    Number two, I've heard that its next to imposible to get the sherif or anybody here in Harris county (Houston) to sign off on the required paperwork. Cant you skip this step by stating that the legal owner of the silencer is a trust fund or corporation? How does that work?
     
  9. MSCHU24

    MSCHU24 Member

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    All I know about making them is that you only have one chance so you better do it right the first try.
     
  10. griff30

    griff30 Member

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    Number 1. You got to have both a form one and four, you need 2 forms (form one is free, sorry Glockman it not thousands.) And the form 4. Call your local BATFE first to see if it's legal I wont testifiy for your state or city as It may be legal in your state but not your city.
    3 Set up an LLC at the . put the silencer in that. No ELO needs to sign an LLC. Period.
    3 this is extra: after you paid the tax you are going to have to wait to get approved, it takes up to 6 months! you can also put it in a will to give to your kids, but cannot give one away. weird?
     
  11. OK, so just to make sure I have them in order:

    1. Set up LLC
    2. Fill out form 1 and 4
    3. Pay tax stamp an wait.
    4. If aproved, build silencer.

    Seems simple enought... but nothing involving the Alphabet soup people ever is. Thanks for the info... maybe part of my "stimulus package" will go back to the guys who took it from me.
     
  12. neothespian

    neothespian Member

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    Heh... in the state of Arizona, while the initial fee is only $200, after the legal and filing fees, you'll be spending just a hair over $600, which eats up that economic stimulus check. Bummer.

    Personally, if I ever get the bug up my rear to build something that is class III, it's going to be FAR more impressive than just a silencer. At that kind of money, I better make it worth MY while.
     
  13. griff30

    griff30 Member

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    Actually step one is call the BATFE just to clarify. Really they are just like you , they love to shoot, and they are VERY helpful in making sure your project is 100% legal. What's a 5 minute phone call? You can always *67 if your of the aluminum foil hat folks like myself.
    The officer I talked to said he gets applications all the time in my area and he said thats why it takes sooo long. Also to make a SBR short barreled rifle is another $200 FYI. This is part of how they get paid guys, tax stamps. So obviously they will want to help.
     
  14. griff30

    griff30 Member

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    Uhm if you mean s full auto conversion, your out of luck. Mr. Ronald Reagan dissapointed would be DIYers and the gun industry by not allowing the manufacture of ANY full auto class 3 firearm by individual or company in the USA for civilian use. In other words, we can ONLY buy what is already made. We can't make or convert them anymore. Thats why the cost of a class 3 firearm is impossible even for old, unreliable, jamomatics. Sorry if this dashes you hopes NEO. Your only choice for class 3 IE: "throwing good money after bad" is a sound suppressor.
    I was hoping Ron Paul could have changed this but thats out and now we look to get more gun laws with the current crop of presidential candidates.
    Maybe a McCain/Rice ticket will keep our current laws but don't expect a reprieve on the good old days.
    Perhaps our VERY best bet is to let Clinton or Obama take over, ban all guns and anything other than bow and arrows. Let things get damn awful bad in the streets and possibly a Chinese or Muslim walk through our country like the French did with Hitler and the general public will see the importance of an armed militia and a right to bare arms.
    On second thought thats not going to happen, there's too many sheep now.
     
  15. Fenix

    Fenix Guest

    Sounds like fun. Also, I agree with the Clinton and Obama theory, if mcCain wins we will lose just as many rights and more people would go along with it than if a dem won.
     
  16. neothespian

    neothespian Member

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    I wasn't just referring to a full auto weapon build from scratch, but more like an extreme sawed off period piece (such as a "Chicago Shotty" or the like) or perhaps a restored automatic.
     
  17. griff30

    griff30 Member

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    Neo that sounds like fun!
    I like the Chicago typewriter myself. Also known as a Thompson SMG.
    Cant wait to see your Mosin finished.
     
  18. A sawed off shotgun is just a SBS or maybe a AOW depending on how its made, they can still be made new (so you can tear into your brand new mossberg and apply and pay for the appropriate stamps) but not so with full auto.

    You are mentioning the word "restored automatic" which is a misnomer. There are TONS of guns coming into the US (well they were) which were at one time full auto (namely AK47s, STENS, PPSHs, AK74s, etc) but to be legally imported into the US, they had to have their receivers destroyed by having at least 3 torch cuts though the receiver that displace a certain amount of metal (I think its 1/8 inch) and in the case of AKs, the torch cut has to go though the evil third hole.

    Same thing with tube guns, RPDs, 1919s, uzis, etc (part kits). Those were full auto guns that were imported after 1986 as an example. They can never be restored to original full auto configuration except by a class 3 dealer for class 3 dealer use only.

    The age of the gun has zero bearing. There is a story of a library that found a mint real WW2 vintage German bring back MG42 in the attic after the librarian (really old vet from ww2) died recently. They said that with the condition of the gun and the originality of it, it was a 200k dollar gun however the guy never registered it under the 68 amnesty or before the 86 ban. So the only thing that could be done with the gun is to fully destroy the invaluable receiver or give it to a police/military dept or possibly let a class 3 dealer own it.

    In a nutshell, that 200k dollar mg42 is worth 2 thousand dollars tops to a civilian as a parts gun.

    Is that what you were hoping that you could do, restore a gun that was originally a full auto to full auto legally? If it was a demilled or deactivated still stamped gun, yes you could do that, but be prepared to spend thousands of dollars for the stamp.

    You are rarely ever paying for the value of the gun, you are paying for the value of the stamp which is in the thousands. in the world of NFA guns, the metal isn't worth much, its that piece of paper which is worth it. Thats why even a deactivated M16 with a plug in the barrel but with a pre-86 NFA stamp is still worth 10-15 thousand dollars, all you would have to do is replace the barrel and you would be ready to go.

    Deactivated means guns that are no longer able to easily fire/shoot projectiles but still can be repaired (plugged barrel, chopped barrel, chamber welded shut, etc), demilled means that the actual receiver has been completely destroyed in the eyes of the BATF.
     
  19. One more question...completely hypothetical..... I know I cant sell them if I made them unless I had a manufacturers license ($$$).... but what if I made one and gave it to my friend (with all the proper forms and stamps being take care off before transfer happens)? or as an example, made one for my brother as a gift.
     
  20. You can't do that unless its a pre-86 NFA stamped gun (civilian transferable). The post dealer samples that class 3 dealers make are owned by the corporation and not by individuals.

    You can't transfer them to family members/friends/etc no matter what.

    If the FFL/dealer goes out of business, the guns have to be transferred to another class 3 dealer/FFL or the guns have to be destroyed in the eyes of the BATF (chopping up the receiver 3 ways with a torch for example).

    Only a dealer can own a post 86 full auto gun and they can only transfer to military/police or other class 3 dealers.

    This has nothing to do with setting up trusts/LLCs for the purpose of having a civilian owning a transferable full auto gun btw.