Always call.

Discussion in 'Lounge' started by slade601, Jun 23, 2014.

  1. slade601

    slade601 Member

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    Coming down on my adrenaline rush atm. It's 3:25 am right now. About 20 minutes ago I was getting ready for bed. Doors locked. Most lights out. I had my shotgun beside the bed tonight instead of the closet tonight. No rounds in the gun but five on the stock.

    All of a sudden I hear a car that sounds close. No big deal. There's always this loud echo from the cars about 150 yards across the street. To ease my curiosity I peek out of the blinds to see headlights in the driveway. I immediately became fully awake and grabbed the shotgun. Loaded one and pumped. Loaded four more.... Then scurried like crazy to put pants on. Yes... Didnt want to go out pantsless. ;)

    I then stand in the hall between my room and the front door. Quiet, listening. Then move to the front door and stand there waiting for the knob to jiggle. Gun aimed at the door. Finger on the safety ready to slide it off and move to trigger. I had forgotten the door was even locked.
    After waiting what seemed like 5 minutes I looked out a gap in the window. Saw the car still sitting there now turned off. Only to realize its my sisters car.

    Wrapping it up. I *****ed her out for not calling and told her she almost had a loaded 12ga pointed at her. But I'm proud to say I still followed most safety rules keeping the finger off the trigger until I saw who it was or gave a warning. My gun will now be loaded. It may have taken me about 27 seconds to fumble those 5 shells under stress.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
  2. SteveC

    SteveC Member

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    Glad it turned out as well as it did. Good on you for thinking about safety rules in the situation.

    Analyzing in hindsight, good to think about the loading issue. Doing anything under stress is always different from doing it without the stress (like yesterday in USPSA match when I fumbled my first reload and the mag went about six feet away lol). You could consider getting some dummy shells and practicing loading - preferably on a timer. Or in the dark. Or with an assistant banging pots and pans or something :) Second, maybe load while you're peeking out the window. Not as helpful to be sitting watching the front door if BP (bad person) is moving to back or side of house.

    Like I said, this is hindsight and I don't know if I would have done anything better in the same situation. This is happily one of those times when you can break the situation down and get some ideas/lessons at a low cost. Hope you get a better night's sleep tonight!

    And hell yes, always call!
     

  3. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    Only part I really disagree with is this. Please don't point the firearm at the door. Keep it pointed in a "safe direction." A Low-Ready would have been fine. It's too easy to bump a cross-bolt safety and bump the trigger in the same stroke when your reflexes and muscles are wigged out on adrenaline. If your sister had actually jiggled the knob, or even stuck her key in the lock and your adrenalin-addled senses interpreted it as a knob-jiggle, you could have easily pumped a round through the door and into her.

    You've got plenty of time to pop the safety and bring it to point from a shouldered position, pointing at the floor.

    Other than that one thing, I don't see a lot I think was "wrong." Yeah, there are some things that could be "better," of course, but nothing else dramatically wrong with it.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  4. FlashBang

    FlashBang I Stand With Talon Lifetime Supporter

    Distance is your friend in a shooting situation. There was no reason for you to move so close to the door. You should have stayed at the furthest point from the door that afforded you a clear sight line. This gives you more time to observe and take in what is happening prior to formulating the decision to shoot or not. It also allows any nefarious individual(s) who are up to no good to enter further into your residence, which makes any actions you take more justifiable. Blasting someone who has not yet broken the threshold of your doorway will most likely get you charged and sued. ;)

    .
     
  5. ArmyScout

    ArmyScout Supporting Member

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    You don't want to shoot someone on your doorstep. You will have to provide some kind of proof that the intruder meant you or your family harm. May just be a drunk trying to get into the wrong house. Shoot someone in that scenario and you are in jail. If you think someone is trying to break into your house, you have ample time to set up a defensive position and get prepared. It's when they are already in your house before you see them, that presents the real threat.
     
  6. tallbump

    tallbump Supporting Member

    I THINK (could be wrong) the Castle Doctrine if yo have it would protect you. In PA it covers you anywhere on your property, and in your car, but it's technically not a Stand Your Ground law either.

    But I do agree that being further back would be better.

    I do have a good friend who has a key to my place. I told him if he ever needs to use it when we're home, especially in the middle of the night, he better let me know it 's him.
     
  7. TRWXXA

    TRWXXA Member

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    The whole "inside the threshold" thing is kind of a myth. The Supreme Court of the United States does recognize the concept of curtilage -- the immediate, private area around your home. In the curtilage you have an expectation of privacy and to be protected from trespass, burglary, illegal search and seizure, etc..

    Generally, it is not important where the use of deadly force takes place. The person using it has to have a reasonable fear that they were in imminent danger of severe bodily harm or death. And that person may have to articulate that reasonable fear to a jury.

    Even in jurisdictions where a person has no duty to retreat, you will have to demonstrate that you were in fear for your life if you shoot someone. Just saying, "He was in my house!" isn't going to cut it. If you can say, "I shouted from my bedroom that I had a gun and the police have been called, yet the intruder kept advancing towards me and my family.", then by all means, blaze away when the creep crests the top of the stairs.

    Bear in mind though... If you grab your gun, or sand wedge, or Louisville Slugger and start wandering around your house looking for someone to use it on, you are going to have a really hard time convincing some prosecutors, or a jury, that you were REALLY in mortal fear. After all... You were skulking around looking for someone to shoot, bludgeon, whatever.

    Don't believe it? Look at George Zimmerman. Even the prosecutor's evidence proved that Trayvon Martin assaulted and battered him in a potentially fatal manner. And they STILL put Zimmerman on trial for murder. Yes... He was found not guilty. But how has his life been the last few years?
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2014
  8. slade601

    slade601 Member

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    I guess I could have been more clear in things. Wasn't too worried about the back door. It's completely caged in with the dogs. And the front door situation, I wasnt directly in front of it but still only about 9 feet away.

    Yes the gun was pointed at the door but I never intended in trying to shoot through it. Give me credit. :D
    And as I had said, I had even forgetten the door was locked. In my head at the time there was no lock. But I had planned to greet "them" with a get on the ground before I ever tried pulling the trigger.

    But its been said. Hindsight is 20/20.
    You know never how prepared or under prepared you are until youre tested.
     
  9. SWAGA

    SWAGA No longer broke... Lifetime Supporter

    I keep my shotgun loaded but empty chamber.
    I don't go looking for trouble but trouble needs to find me....
    My cow instructor specifically told us that under Florida law you can't go clearing your house as this is 'looking for a fight'.
     
  10. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    I didn't say you intended to shoot through the door. I said that an adrenalin driven flinch response could cause an ND which, while pointed at the door, could be fatal to someone you don't want it too. Keep the firearm pointed in a safe direction. Low Ready (stock on the shoulder and muzzle pointed down but in front of you) is sufficient to be on target quickly.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  11. SWAGA

    SWAGA No longer broke... Lifetime Supporter

    Pistol but good scenario none the less
    [ame]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YD3zIA6vJkQ[/ame]
     
  12. slade601

    slade601 Member

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    I understand. There's definitely stuff that could've been done differently.
     
  13. Bull

    Bull Just a Man Supporting Member


    Hey, don't sweat it.... I've been doing the same job for 20+ years, still learn things I didn't know, or had never seen... Incorporate the good ideas, learn from the bad, ain't no biggee.
     
  14. forgotenpast

    forgotenpast Member

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  15. tallbump

    tallbump Supporting Member

    Safety first of course. But one thing to point out about our scenario is that is unlikely that this was someone up to know good. (I mean, obviously we know it wasn't) but it wouldn't be the way most "bad guys" woudl have acted.

    From someone who may or may not have and actual knowledge based on past experiences of how a bad guy would attempt something like this, it it HIGHLY unlikely they would have pulled in your driveway. Even if so, it is even far less likely that they would have had their headlights on.

    Again, you can never be too safe, and with all the strange drugs and drunks out there, you never know. Just something to think about in the grand scheme of events as someone else goes through somethign like this.
     
  16. slade601

    slade601 Member

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    I live way out in a rural area pretty much. Basically never a crime out here I always thought. Then that car theft happens I mentioned in another thread. After that happened I've been a bit more weary around here.
     
  17. GoesBang

    GoesBang Supporting Member

    One reason to keep one in the pipe. Regardless where you live.

    [ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jHQqcky_Aw&feature=kp[/ame]
     
  18. tallbump

    tallbump Supporting Member

    Makes perfect sense about being weary. Like I sad, safety first.

    What I was trying to point out that most likely if it was someone looking to do harm, they probably either wouldn't have pulled in the driveway, or would have killed the headlights before doing so. I won't go into detail but I now that's how it's usually done...at least by smart folks