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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Well I've pretty much have had it with the police department in the city I live in!

3 weeks ago 6 guys came to my house ( I live in an old house made into two apartments ) and tried steeling the neighbors motor cycle right on the porch in the middle of the day. We chased them away then called the police; dispatch said they would not send the police they were busy. Then an hour later these 6 guys come back with 9 more for a total of 15 people mad because we stopped them from stealing the motor cycle. We were outside this time cooking some BBQ on the grill; now these guys wanna fight. The one threatens to pull out a gun and shoot us; I have a CPL (concealed pistol license) I draw my gun 15 guys on 2 people is a deadly threat in my eyes, and I wasn't taking any chances. They decide they had enough and took off, no shots fired. We called the police while all this was happening and they still wouldn't send out an officer! Told them everything that happened, they just don't care.

2 weeks ago this same group of people jump and beat up an older gentlemen around 60 years old because they wanted his bike he was riding down the street. The older gentlemen calls the police guess what? they still didn't show up!

Then tonight is what pushed me over the edge. I'm in my garage helping the guy up stairs work on his mud bogging jeep. As we're standing there 5 guys walk into the guys yard 2 houses down and try to break into his house to steal his dog. We call the police they said they would send out a cop guess what? I stood outside waiting for the police for 3 hours! Never showed up. We chased the guys out of his yard just by yelling hey we called the police. Oh and 5 minutes after they run off, 2 other guys come walking down the road looking for these same guys who just jumped his son and stole his dog!

The police will do nothing around here and me and my neighbors are completely fed up with this crap! I decided tomorrow I'm gonna go file a formal complaint against the police department. People are being assaulted, robbed, and threatened, and the police do nothing they don't even show up.

I don't know what else to do but to file a complaint 7 of my neighbors are also filing a complaint. I just can't believe the low quality of law enforcement we have in this city.
 

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Go to the press. Bad PR seems more effective than any internal complaint system.

Oh, and P.S. remind me not to move into your neighborhood. ;)
 

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Just curious as I am from MI too what city are we discussing? If you would rather not say I understand that too!

In the small town where I reside we contract with the County Sheriffs Dept and the Sheriff himself lives in the town .... so to make a long story short if something goes down it is usually the Sheriff on the spot ASAP.. there have been nights when things were popping all over the county and we have had a 20min wait but they always get someone out to look into whatever the problem is.

What you are describing is unacceptable and I think if the formal complaint doesn't do it then I would go to the media.... sometimes it takes airing the dirty laundry to get some people to act!
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Just curious as I am from MI too what city are we discussing? If you would rather not say I understand that too!

In the small town where I reside we contract with the County Sheriffs Dept and the Sheriff himself lives in the town .... so to make a long story short if something goes down it is usually the Sheriff on the spot ASAP.. there have been nights when things were popping all over the county and we have had a 20min wait but they always get someone out to look into whatever the problem is.

What you are describing is unacceptable and I think if the formal complaint doesn't do it then I would go to the media.... sometimes it takes airing the dirty laundry to get some people to act!
I have no problem letting everyone know what city it is I just forgot to mention it in my post because I was on a major rant lol

Its Saginaw Michigan
 

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Well seeing as they have like 1/3 of the police force they had just 4 years ago they most likely really don't have anyone to send!

I know that is not what you want to hear.... According to a cousin of mine who lives in Midland and is married to a state trooper that whole Saginaw Vally area is understaffed and the state police are stretched thin as well trying to take up the slack. Michigan is hurting that is for sure! Grand Rapids is suffering from many of the same understaffing problems as Saginaw.

According to a fellow I went to school with who drives for UPS up there. He said that he nearly got car jacked in his ups truck :?: He ended up driving to a police station to give his report because they had no officers available to respond... I have seen this tag line and it fits "when seconds count the police are minutes away" or hours or never if they don't have the staff :evil:

This is why we the people have to take our firearm rights and use them to the best of our ability to protect those near and dear to us ..... just is you indicated you did :!:

Stay safe and watch your back!!
 

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Any LEO's care to comment?

These examples are pretty blatant to be ignored. My vote is to stay armed - multiple and many - alert the media, local and other. Maybe even call major networks and get some national attention?

And last, may not apply, but call the FBI / ACLU / Who ever about civil rights, lack of protection, etc.

And furthermore! Have you attended local township meetings, etc. and complained? Visibility may be your best bet.

Stay alert and stay safe.
 

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I'd be very careful now that those guys know you have a gun. They may figure to break into your home to steal any firearms there so I hope you have them locked up tight.

I highly recommend going to the media but make sure to have some factual info & maybe even some pictures to give them.
Log the phone calls & times, response times & officers names.
The media won't print anything unless they have factual info to print.
 

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File a complaint with the PD AND go to the media as well. Just 1 thing to remember if you file a complaint the PD may be a little put out with you and start to find all sorts of reasons to pull you over and /or make life a bit miserable for you so be forwarned. BUT sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

Good luck and keep yer powder dry and extra ammo handy. Sounds like you got a war brewing.
 

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The media won't print anything unless they have factual info to print.
:lol: :lol: You're kidding, right?????

[ Just jokin' with ya. I agree - REAL news will get them engaged much better and faster than someone just complaining. ]
 

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WOW :shock: that is a complete load of BS you call and there too busy. This reminds me of why I got my LTCF and my first gun I came home and my front door was unlocked and my mother's car wasnt here so I flagged down a officer coming up the street and told him what was going on and he avoided trying to go into the house to check and there were 2 officers in the car. But after pleading and feeling like tool they went in and checked then when nothing was found they told me I wasted there time and in my rage I said well next time I call you it will be to pick up a body. They told me as long as I do it legally no problem. So the next day I went out and bought my first weapon and went to get my LTCF. Like others have said stay alert and keep the meat wagon number on speed dial you may need it sounds like a war is brewing and do make a formal complaint just follow the proper chain of command and do see the media this dirty laundry needs to be aired for everyone to see.
 
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I hate to say it, but it sounds like you need to move... thugs running amuck and it does appear lack of staffing with local PD is the problem.

When I worked for a small county here in Montana, the county commissioners wanted to turn a blind eye to everything, and always asked why we didn't just keep the peace instead of enforcing the laws.

The sheriff kept telling me to slow down, you may get yourself into something you can't get out of..... yep, he was a theif and I caught him. I have a very sour taste for crooked cops, and worse for those who are crooked that are in charge.

I caught the sheriff

It cost me my job and basicly career simply because I had enough after being an LEO for over 20 yrs in various places. I have friends who for lack of better words, look at me with a differant prospective now, simply because I crossed the blue line.

Sorry to ramble on away from your situation.

You need to attend City Council meetings or Township Meetings, or even better yet run for office to make changes happen. I wish you luck in your situation.
 

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Create a neighborhood watch group.

Contact the local DA office and verify your legal rights to protect yourself, and your property. Find out about specific legal rights for making a citezens arrest and methods for subduing and holding someone who has threatened your life or property. Get it in writing.

I do not condone vigilante justice, but we DO have the power to enforce the laws up to a point and when it gets bad we need to do just that.
 

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Any LEO's care to comment?
I agree that the media is the most effective way to get the problem in the public eye. It sounds like Saginaw has the same budget crunch that the rest of the country has. The departments that get complaints are the ones that get funded. Stupid I know but thats the way it seems to be.

I would also file a written complaint with the mayor, and separate letters to the city council members. Also a letter to any state or federal leaders from your area. Start a petition and get the neighbors to sign it demanding more police protection, and be the squeaky wheel until something is done.

If possible try to be positive, use the spin that this is happening "because they are so under staffed and funded" That way you don't become a double target, as law enforcement tends to be a career of egos or rather EGOS. Don't give the chief grounds to invalidate your permit, instead call and ask about funding and what you as John Q Citizen can do to help, then do it. If you get him on your side by trying to get on his, you may start seeing more marked units in the neighborhood.

It may not hurt to call or stop in (leave your gun in the car) talk to the chief face to face before you take action, again get him on your side.

Take Care and Stay Safe.
 

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Any LEO's care to comment?
I agree that the media is the most effective way to get the problem in the public eye. It sounds like Saginaw has the same budget crunch that the rest of the country has. The departments that get complaints are the ones that get funded. Stupid I know but thats the way it seems to be.

I would also file a written complaint with the mayor, and separate letters to the city council members. Also a letter to any state or federal leaders from your area. Start a petition and get the neighbors to sign it demanding more police protection, and be the squeaky wheel until something is done.

If possible try to be positive, use the spin that this is happening "because they are so under staffed and funded" That way you don't become a double target, as law enforcement tends to be a career of egos or rather EGOS. Don't give the chief grounds to invalidate your permit, instead call and ask about funding and what you as John Q Citizen can do to help, then do it. If you get him on your side by trying to get on his, you may start seeing more marked units in the neighborhood.

It may not hurt to call or stop in (leave your gun in the car) talk to the chief face to face before you take action, again get him on your side.

Take Care and Stay Safe.
 

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The neighborhood watch group is a good idea in that it will get other folks in the same area calling the PD and getting disgusted when they get no response which will in turn reinforce your position when and if you get the media involved... IE more people to interview about the same recurring problem :!:

FYI we have a neighborhood watch group here in little ol Lawrence and we have nailed Meth cookers and drug pushers mostly wacky tobacco as well as day time bunglers er burglers and car thieves! The way we have ours setup if you notice something suspicius you call county dispatch directly and not 911. then you call the two nearest block commanders and we attempt to get multiple descriptions of the perp or perps and or licence plate numbers without endangering our selves so if they do get away the police have a better chance of catching them. Now I know this sounds like overkill but we like our little town crime free so we work at it very hard. Most of the retired folks watch birds with field glasses ...and have scanners too so when they hear dispatch talking about such and such address they start checking things out with the field glasses.. pretty funny whn the crook has the cops waiting when he gets home... :twisted:

It takes time and community meetings to get it setup .. ours took 2 years to get completly off the ground.. it also takes police participation.. but when the good folks in the community can be the eyes and ears of the department it can actually save time and help greatly with investigations.

OK i'll get off the soapbox :lol:
 
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Well seeing as they have like 1/3 of the police force they had just 4 years ago they most likely really don't have anyone to send!

I know that is not what you want to hear.... According to a cousin of mine who lives in Midland and is married to a state trooper that whole Saginaw Vally area is understaffed and the state police are stretched thin as well trying to take up the slack. Michigan is hurting that is for sure! Grand Rapids is suffering from many of the same understaffing problems as Saginaw.

According to a fellow I went to school with who drives for UPS up there. He said that he nearly got car jacked in his ups truck :?: He ended up driving to a police station to give his report because they had no officers available to respond... I have seen this tag line and it fits "when seconds count the police are minutes away" or hours or never if they don't have the staff :evil:

This is why we the people have to take our firearm rights and use them to the best of our ability to protect those near and dear to us ..... just is you indicated you did :!:

Stay safe and watch your back!!
My question has to be, if they cut back the police force by 1/3, did they increase the concealed carry by 2/3, and reduce the tax base by 1/3 ?????????????

Doc
 

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Or a 12 gauge close to hand! loaded with 00 buck... there is something very intimidating about that gun even to a big group :shock:

Just a story about large group dispersion.. my grandfather on my mothers side tells a story about a group of teenagers from Philly coming out to the burbs and causing trouble. well one night they got into my grandparents swimming pool around 2:00 am and were making a bunch of noise. Allegedly my grandfather raised the window on there 2nd floor room and stuck the 12 gauge out and said " get out of my pool or this shotgun will speak" followed by racking the slide to chamber a round. The story goes that in the morning the police had no trouble finding the trouble makers because they had left there clothes and wallets in there haste. According to gramps the group was 13 kids or so ... at least that was how many pants they collected :lol:
 

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If your complaint is as stated then have the 911 calls you made subpoenaed then present them along with your complaint. That way there is no he said/she said and only the facts are presented. Hard for the Police to deny lack of service if they hear it for them selfs.
That's assuming they haven't been "misplaced".

You'd be amazed what people can lose now it's all on digital storage.
 
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