[Silicon Wolverine]

Ok, lets create a difinative Hi cap thread so we can avoid the weekly "what about hi cap mags" threads that seem to pop up time after time.

1. Pro mag 15 rounders are sketchy at best. some members have made them work by modifying the feed lips. ive had zero luck with them. buy at your own risk.

2. the 30 round drum mag that rumors persist about doesnt exist. period. its just rumors.

3. The suomi drum modification has yet to be built and function properly with a HP. Several memebrs have built them (myself included) with no success. there are too many obstacles to overcome in this conersion.

4. double stack mags would require a mojor stock redesign and beemailler has already stated thats not on the table.

5. if you can create a working, reliable magazine of 30 rounds or more, and it is proven by a mod or admin of this board, you will be declared a demi-god and money will fall into your hands in mass quantities (mostly from members here).

SW

 

[Krippp]

been needed for awhile, thanks SW

 

[sbroomheadsr]

Demi-god... hmmm. :think:

 

[Guest]

If someone has a Suomi drum for me to mod, Ill make it work.



.40S&W please.


.

 

[NDS]

4. double stack mags would require a mojor stock redesign and beemailler has already stated thats not on the table.
SW

Too bad a simple redesign of the stock would be insufficient, we'd all have that mod done and have Hi-Cap Hi-Points (like the WASR lo-cap guys do)
I think it would take a major redesign of the action of the rifle, since that is the narrow part that a double-stack magazine can't get into.

It would be nice if such a redesign were done, but from what's been posted it appears the company has no desire to do so.

 

[waltham41]

I believe that Hi Point limits the size of their mags because they do not want to fall into the assault rifle category any more than they mistakenly are now.

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

MOD NOTE- I deleted/edited several posts. This is NOT the topic to discuss the merits of hicaps in HPs vs any other gun. This topic is to convey to new members what works, what doesnt and the current state of mag offerings over 10 rounds. Any further posts not on those subjects will be deleted.

SW

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

If someone has a Suomi drum for me to mod, Ill make it work.

.40S&W please.

.

40 S&W wont fit in a suomi drum, the case is too long. Nice idea though.

SW

 

[Guest]

Are there any .40 drum mags?

If not, someone send me their Suomi and a 995 and Ill whip this up, toot suite!:wink:

It shouldnt be too hard to lop off the offending parts and replace them with the sheet metal of a HP Mag.

.

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

The issues me and others ran into with the suomi drum conversion were these:

the spring pressure in a suomi drum is so high (to keep the rounds feeding around the snail type magazine innards) that a HP mag feedlips wont hold them in. they warp outward and allow the rounds to ratle out or they constantly jam because they arent feeding at the right angle. We discussed using a different magzine from another handgun such as a SIG P6 or single stack 1911 9mm design to overcome this but cost was too great for experimentation.

materials. specifically, getting them to stay together. everyone thats done this has had issues with the mag breaking away from the drum body. the material of a HP mag is so thin its almost imposible to weld properly without overheating and making it brittle, and thus prone to breakage. i had the best luck with MIG welding the mag body on after using a die grinder to cut slots in the suomi feedlips and using a grinder ball to rough up the work area. that attempt never did break but after that last round of testing cracks were beginning to appear (about 500 rounds or so). The weght issue may have something to do with this as well.

mag release. a loaded sumoi drum with 72 rounds in it weighs enough it sags lower in the magwell then a regular mag and causes feeding issues. i solved this in my prototype (for testing) by looping a 3" neoprene O-ring from the carry loop of the drum, to a hook i put under one of the reciver cover bolts. this allowed the drum assy to "float" up and down as needed for proper feeding.

stock. the stock must be cut away a small amount to allow clearance of the drum if it is built with 10 round mags. if you used a 15 round promag you could alleviate this.

I did get 40-50 shot stings without a jam when i was in the "middle" of the magazine but it always jammed at the start and finish of a full drum.

Overall i spent over 200$ in testing for drums, mags and other parts and 350$ for tesing ammo and ended up with nada. im sold my prototypes and parts to a user on the old forum to recoup some of my costs and i havent seen him around the new forum.

As for 40 cal hi caps, the only gun i know of that used a magazine over 16 rounds was the MP5-40 and they were 30 round stick mags. Beretta made a prototype series 12 SMG in 40 but it naver made it past the prototype stage.

ETA HK also makes the UMP in 40 S&W. being as the mags are polymer this may be a viable source for a hi cap 40. My searches turned up no sources past HK for mags though.


SW

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

Actually, Hi-Point has contracted different R&D companies to fabricate the largest capacity round magazine that they can get to reliably work. If they can get 15 rounds to work, that's what they'll go with. If all they can get to reliably work is 12 rounds, then 12 it is. This is for all the pistols and carbines. Hi-Point mags are getting a complete overhaul. Alot of this has to do with our voice on the forum requesting higher capacity mags. You guys may not realize it, but employees at MKS and Beemiller cruise this forum for suggestions and ideas on how to make their weapons better.

This information is straight from Charlie and Kelly who both work for MKS Supply. I was given this information when Elguapo and I were at the Shot Show.

-posted by Primal in another thread. thought id post it here for reference.

SW

 

[Guest]

Your attempt at at 72 round :shock: mag is the same type of thing I have to desperatly try and keep myself from doing. Cool? Hell yeah! Goos starting point? Nope, straight into overkill. I mention this from the viewpoint of having many years (22 yrs as a Toolmaker.) and many projects worth of prospective.

I thoght you were talking about the 30rd Bersa drum mags. This would limit the amount ot troubles you were having with the feedlips and so forth. As far as attaching the two mags together you have two options, Brazing and Tig welding. Your mig welder will do it IF your very good at doing thing sheet work. The trick to this type of delicate work with a welder is to draw back the parts after welding.

Drawing them back to a semi annealed state will resolve the cracking issue and turn otherwise marginal welds into OKish welds. Even good welds on thin material like this will crack if not annealed, only they will probably do it alongside the weld in the parent metal.

Ill have to look up some of those MP mags. I would only use them for their parts, but if their cheap enough.......

.

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

The reason started with the suomi mags is they are seel and thus alot easier for the home guys to work on. the bersa mags are polymer and thus harder for the DIY crowd to play with.

I know about annealing thin sheetmetal welds, i jst never got that far in the project. i wanted to confirm functionality before i wasted a pile of time with long term reliability. had i come up with a workable, funcitoning deisgn, id have gone back and done that.

http://www.hkparts.net/510.htm
these were only 40 magaines i could find. at 65$ each they aint cheap.

SW

 

[pjm204]

I've welded sten mags together with good success. I had to file the inside after welding due to some burnthrough but it feeds reliably. For the springs I just zip-tied the springs together which I know sounds sketchy but it works very well. I haven't tried welding HP mags but I might try it eventually. If I could get mags for cheaper I would be more inclined to try it.

 

[Silicon Wolverine]

on the subject of welding mags together, i did a few steel CETME mags back during the ban (yes it was legal) to make 40 round 308 mags. its not easy, but its doable-given the material is thick enough. the thin sheet steel of HP mags would be very dificult. if you could find steel tubing the correct size, (i have yet to) you could build one as long as you could make a spring for.

In "expediant homemade firearms" by P.A. Luty, the author talks about making a single stack 9mm magzine from 35x16mm ERW steel tubing and making a mag spring from 20-gauge piano wire. This is theoretically possible but extremly difficult to produce a working finished product. Anyone with a modicum of metal skills can make a mandrel and bend and weld sheet steel better.

SW

 

[tommy20/69]

if i could get my hands on some spring material to mess with i bet i could get a working drumm mag.does anyone have some spring material they could donate to the cause i have the sheet metal i might beable to make the spings ,self just for s proto type and then maybe send it off the a spring maker and have a professional pring made.what i would need is a mag follower in .9mm/49s&w and some sping material atleast 18"long and a few mags to chop up to make some of the pieces but i know i could probably make a drum or banna clip a banna clip for sure.

 

[Guest]

MOD NOTE- I deleted/edited several posts. This is NOT the topic to discuss the merits of hicaps in HPs vs any other gun. This topic is to convey to new members what works, what doesnt and the current state of mag offerings over 10 rounds. Any further posts not on those subjects will be deleted.

SW

Ok then, is there a sticky where we can plead our case to Hi-Point to make a higher cap mag? This is the MAJOR weakness of their carbines. Most 9mm pistols come with a stock mag of 15-17 rounds. At the very least Hi-Point could mod the 15 round ProMags to be reliable and then sell them at a profit. OK, you can delete this post now.

 

[Strangerous]

MOD NOTE- I deleted/edited several posts. This is NOT the topic to discuss the merits of hicaps in HPs vs any other gun. This topic is to convey to new members what works, what doesnt and the current state of mag offerings over 10 rounds. Any further posts not on those subjects will be deleted.

SW

Ok then, is there a sticky where we can plead our case to Hi-Point to make a higher cap mag? This is the MAJOR weakness of their carbines. Most 9mm pistols come with a stock mag of 15-17 rounds. At the very least Hi-Point could mod the 15 round ProMags to be reliable and then sell them at a profit. OK, you can delete this post now.

There's a whole forum full of threads... "HiPoint Suggestion Zone" http://www.hipointfirearmsforums.com/Forum/index.php/board,14.0.html

 

[Guest]

thanks!

 

[BooTz]

okay.. some guy mod a 1911 mag to hold and fire 17 rounds of 40S&W in a 4095.. now i DO know that a drum mag exists for the 1911... sooooo???