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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I went to the range with a couple of my friends that tried out my Hi-Point C 9mm (C9 in all but name). Both of them used the standard grip on the pistol where both thumbs rested on the left side of it, curled with one behind the other. The problem with that was it left their thumbs quite close to the slide as they used it, and during firing, they had accidentally dropped a magazine or two due to their fingers being so close to the magazine release. Let's just say that did not give them a favorable first impression of the piece.

What sorts of grasping styles would fit the C9 best? I personally prefer using it with one hand or "tea cupping" to minimize finger real estate around the magazine release.
 

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Sounds like they're whiskey gripping the pistol to try and fight the recoil. I've got big hands with long enough thumbs to reach the trigger and I've never experienced those issues. Not even when shooting left handed and covering the mag release with my palm.

Tell your friends to relax their grip and point their thumbs at the target instead of trying to use them to grip the pistol. The fingers are fully able to keep the pistol from falling out of their hands. It's supposed to be a push/pull grip, not a stranglehold.

I would put money on them squeezing their grip hand thumb as they're firing, causing the mag drops...

Push: The "V" of the grip hand thumb, in conjuction with the wrist, should support the frame and weight of the pistol while the fingers are lightly wrapped around the grip and only there to keep it in place. The thumb should point towards the target and not wrap around the grip.

Pull: The off hand covers the grip hand to further support the weight and mitigate recoil.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I would put money on them squeezing their grip hand thumb as they're firing, causing the mag drops...

Push: The "V" of the grip hand thumb, in conjuction with the wrist, should support the frame and weight of the pistol while the fingers are lightly wrapped around the grip and only there to keep it in place. The thumb should point towards the target and not wrap around the grip.

Pull: The off hand covers the grip hand to further support the weight and mitigate recoil.
That's most likely the case. I did it once too, so I'm not alone.
 

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Never had that happen with any pistol.
It's all in the grip like Rachgier posted above.

72923


" Brian Enos, along with his good friend Rob Leatham,
developed the straight-thumbs method of gripping a handgun
that is the standard among serious shooters today."
 

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Never had that happen with any pistol.
It's all in the grip like Rachgier posted above.

View attachment 72923

" Brian Enos, along with his good friend Rob Leatham,
developed the straight-thumbs method of gripping a handgun
that is the standard among serious shooters today."
I use and teach thumb over thumb because it's relatively idjit proof.
 
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" Brian Enos, along with his good friend Rob Leatham,
developed the straight-thumbs method of gripping a handgun
that is the standard among serious shooters today."
More accurate to say that they popularized it and that now it has become unchallenged dogma.

I mean, I like it and all. It's my preferred two-handed grip. But I can document variations of two-handed grip being taught back to before WWI. Heck, Rex Applegate (of point-shooting fame), in his classic Kill or Get Killed, shows three two-handed shooting grips including the the thumbs forward grip. And just saying it's "the standard among serious shooters" implies that if you're not doing it then you're not a "serious shooter" ...and that's a hallmark of dogma.

72937


Peace favor your sword,
Kirk
 
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That.........
And just saying it's "the standard among serious shooters" implies that if you're not doing it then you're not a "serious shooter" ...and that's a hallmark of dogma.
quote was from this article:

When I started in IPSC that was the grip I used after watching the top shooters.
That and keeping both eyes open.
 

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@lklawson your illustration shows thumb over thumb. The two individuals @Keystone is referring to created straight thumbs. It's a slightly different grip that requires a much bigger break of the support hand wrist to move that thumb forward so then both thumbs almost align on the same plane. It's very awkward.

They discuss the differences between thumb over thumb and straight thumbs in the article Keystone provided.
 

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Definitely awkward! Takes a lot of practice to do it naturally.
I use the thumb over as it seems more natural and comfortable.
All that, plus it's a universal type grip that even works with revolvers. Straight thumbs doesn't.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 · (Edited)
Never had that happen with any pistol.
It's all in the grip like Rachgier posted above.

View attachment 72923

" Brian Enos, along with his good friend Rob Leatham,
developed the straight-thumbs method of gripping a handgun
that is the standard among serious shooters today."
Trouble is, that puts your thumb rather close to the slide that moves along. Basically, you can't really support it with your thumbs when the slide is going to keelhaul your thumb.

72938

My hands are pretty big. I could put one hand's thumb on there nice and straight, but two? not much room for it.
 

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Your thumb needs to ride the grip higher, just barely under the edge of the slide, and point directly at the target not curl down. You're also gripping with your thumb and fingers too hard. I can tell by the perfusion of your nail beds. Relax your grip, slide your grip hand thumb up to the top of the grip. Notice how the grip panel is flared outwards and away from the slide? Your support hand thumb will fit just fine in that gap between your grip hand thumb and forefinger.

You should always grip as high up on a pistol as possible, while still avoiding slide bite. Even the best shooters in the world get bit now and again, so don't be afraid of it.
 
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Your thumb needs to ride the grip higher, just barely under the edge of the slide, and point directly at the target not curl down. You're also gripping with your thumb and fingers too hard. I can tell by the perfusion of your nail beds. Relax your grip, slide your grip hand thumb up to the top of the grip. Notice how the grip panel is flared outwards and away from the slide? Your support hand thumb will fit just fine in that gap between your grip hand thumb and forefinger.

You should always grip as high up on a pistol as possible, while still avoiding slide bite. Even the best shooters in the world get bit now and again, so don't be afraid of it.
Thanks for the tips! I'm more used to revolver shooting so my thumb curls down naturally. When I was at the range, I had a better time with a somewhat firm grip, allowing the pistol to fit into my hand under recoil, and adjust my hold on it from there. I also have a digital copy of Applegate's book on hand too, so I could take a look at that. I had originally seeked it out for tips on revolver shooting.
 

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Thanks for the tips! I'm more used to revolver shooting so my thumb curls down naturally. When I was at the range, I had a better time with a somewhat firm grip, allowing the pistol to fit into my hand under recoil, and adjust my hold on it from there. I also have a digital copy of Applegate's book on hand too, so I could take a look at that. I had originally seeked it out for tips on revolver shooting.
The cool thing about thumb over thumb is it is for shooting any pistol two-handed, including revolvers. Obviously size matters, for the hand and pistol frame anyways, but it can be adapted to any handgun or shooter. All you have to do is practice which means more time having fun if your trigger time doubles as therapy like mine does.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
The cool thing about thumb over thumb is it is for shooting any pistol two-handed, including revolvers. Obviously size matters, for the hand and pistol frame anyways, but it can be adapted to any handgun or shooter. All you have to do is practice which means more time having fun if your trigger time doubles as therapy like mine does.
Update regarding the Magazine Drops:
I had contacted Strassel about my magazine issues, and they sent me a new Mag Catch and Magazine release springs, and I believe that the problem has been significantly reduced! The mag release is a lot more firm, and the new mag catch feels a lot more positive catching onto its mags.
I think with more practice (And a much firmer magazine release) I'll reduce this issue significantly.
 
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