[Foolsgold39]

Hey team,

I was hoping in this thread we could talk sundance pistols. The good, the bad, the ugly. This is another sns I have no experience with and I would love to know more about them in case I stumble upon one. Thanks for any help/information in advance!

@adam01364
@CulperRing
@Rabidwookie
@bumthum

(Group bat signal for the sns crowd! Apologies to whom ever I've forgotten. Been a long day)

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[adam01364]

@Foolsgold39 You might start with this article:
https://www.hipointfirearmsforums.com/articles/the-sundance-point-blank-handgun.347/

 

[Foolsgold39]

Adam,

Your the man! Thanks! I was really hoping that little derringer would come up!!!

Strong work my friend.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[CulperRing]

I have an A-25, it feels pretty good in the hand. I have done not anything with it for awhile. Checking my notes, I had feeding issues galore and had one round get struck (had to push it out).

I would like to get one of the laser models (forgot the name).

 

[CulperRing]

One other issue that also pops up with Ravens is gripping it. If I grip it too high it seems to mess with the slide.

 

[Foolsgold39]

CulperRing,

Good stuff thanks! When you say griping to high, I assume your not talking about slide bite?

Yes, the laser model is one of my grails. So gloriously janky lol.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[Rerun]

Superior article!

eldar

 

[CulperRing]

CulperRing,

Good stuff thanks! When you say griping to high, I assume your not talking about slide bite?

Yes, the laser model is one of my grails. So gloriously janky lol.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

Not really slide bite. Just seems like there is not enough power at times to move the slide.

 

[Foolsgold39]

CulperRing,

Copy, thanks!

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[adam01364]

the laser model is one of my grails.

@CulperRing There were two models, the 'Laser 25' and the 'Lady Laser'. (Same gun, just different rollmarks on the slide.) The pistol is simply a BOA 25 with an integrated laser. AFAIK, they were mostly in chrome but I've seen one in black.

You can find them out there but be prepared to part with a at least a couple of Benjamins.

 

[adam01364]

I have an A-25, it feels pretty good in the hand.

The A-25 is basically a reworked Raven. I've always liked how they curved the back of the slide to lessen slide bite, and the push-button mag release was a step up as well.

I've seen A-25s with solid take down buttons with a shortened F/P, and also some with take down buttons with a cocked chamber hole. If you have one with a solid take down button and you break a F/P, you can use a Raven F/P and cut off the tail with a Dremel. It doesn't look the same but it worked fine for me.

Comparison pix:

 

[Foolsgold39]

Adam01364,

That is an awesome couple posts, thank you! Seriously good stuff.

What other issues have you run into with the little guys? As a reworked kinda raven have you been able to adapt other parts to fit? Time to time I've looked at sundance parts kits online out of curiosity but they are far less common then a few of the others.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[adam01364]

Mebbe I should've said "refined" instead of "reworked" as most parts won't interchange.

One of the problems of owning a Sundance is finding additional magazines that are affordable. Raven magazines are the most commonly available, but they are too short, and any magazine you find that is long enough will need to have a cut out for the mag release.

That being say, I did find that FIE Guardian just fit and Lorcin L25 mags were long enough to do the job (you still have to do the cut out). The Lorcin L25 mag did protrude out the bottom though.

Disclaimer: Using difference guns magazines is never an ideal situation and what worked for me may not work for you.

Sundance A-25 compared to an FIE Guardian; you can see the Guardian mag is just CH shorter.

Lorcin L25 magazine on the right; and protruding mag.

 

[Foolsgold39]

Adam01364,

Good stuff! Seriously, I dig it and appreciate it. Magizines can always be a problem and I love seeing adaptions and fixes. I admit I'm some what obsessive in having a bunch of mags for anything I own, so I really appreciate the info.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[retread]

Adam,

Your the man! Thanks! I was really hoping that little derringer would come up!!!

Strong work my friend.

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[bumthum]

I have an A-25, it feels pretty good in the hand. I have done not anything with it for awhile. Checking my notes, I had feeding issues galore and had one round get struck (had to push it out).

I would like to get one of the laser models (forgot the name).

I honestly do not own a Sundance, I've been so focused on Ravens that I stupidly neglected some SNS deals when they were available cheaply. Oh well. I can dig the Lady Laser though, these were selling on GB for <$75, but I'm sure they're $1K+ now.

Most of the post-Raven Arms SNS firearms seem to have various levels of poor quality control and, to cheapen production, lack some of the nicer features of the Raven. For instance the P-25,MP-25, Raven series all have hardened steel "bolts" cast into the slide. The added complication of turning these bolts on a lathe, shipping them to the caster, inserting them into a now more complicated die, dealing with the differential heating and cooling of the ZAMAK and steel, etc... was just a bridge too far for most SNS producers. For many, the steel breechface became a "feature" of their larger caliber pistols, rather than a standard requirement of the entire product line. That's just one example, but it shows how there was a shift away from efficiently producing a quality firearm, that was still affordable, to just cranking something out that could be marketed to the poors and fired a few times before being discarded.

 

[adam01364]

As I posted earlier, I should've said "refined" instead of "reworked" as most parts won't interchange. Here's an example of a refinement: Steven R. Jennings' "Grip Safety For A Pistol" patent (Patent No. 5,036,612) which shows exactly how the Sundance BOA grip safety works:

 

[bumthum]

As I posted earlier, I should've said "refined" instead of "reworked" as most parts won't interchange. Here's an example of a refinement: Steven R. Jennings' "Grip Safety For A Pistol" patent (Patent No. 5,036,612) which shows exactly how the Sundance BOA grip safety works:

Interestingly, I've searched for years and found little, if any, in the way of US made SNS related patents. So many design features were taken from existing pistol designs, there just wasn't much to patent. So this grip safety actually represents some real innovation among SNS companies. It's fascinating stuff in my opinion. Thank you for posting this.

 

[Foolsgold39]

Gents,

Great stuff, thank you. I really enjoy these discussions.

R.e. sns innovation. This is one reason why I've been really rooting for Cobra. To the best of my knowledge their Denali is the first original sns design in a long time.

Thanks for the grip saftey patent material. Very interesting.

On the note of Sundance parts I recently stumbled upon this company. I have never used them and have zero affiliation with them so I hope it's ok to link this here. The company makes new stainless steel and titanium firing pins for damn near everything, including a lot sns pistols, including the Sundance. Made in the usa.

https://www.firingpins.com/firing-pin-parts/sundance-firing-pins

Regards,
Foolsgold39

 

[Foolsgold39]

Retread,

View attachment 70103

Is that little derringer yours? I would love to hear your first hand thoughts on it of you've got the time.

Thanks!

Regards,
Foolsgold39