Hi-Point Firearms Forums banner
1 - 8 of 8 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
but since this subforum is about:
... Shooting Tips. This Forum is for Stuff that just doesn't fit everywhere else.
I thought I'd post this here...

I've posted it on another gun forum... but I'm interested in what you guys think... I have no association with these people... but I am interested in the concepts it shows..

There's a "different" system of SD gun handling called C.A.R. and the civilian version of it is IPD

IPD is Based on C.A.R. which is currently being "trained into" some law enforcement, some military. IPD is the "civilian" version... less to do with the "team" you would have in LE or MIL. But the shooting techniques are the same.

Since most SD encounters occur within 10' or most HD in 10 Yds. this system is adaptable to both.

There are many fine point nuances to the stances and and grips that you won't get from the vids or pics. And if you should have an instructor nearby, class with live fire requires you bring ~800 rounds. Why? Because when you leave the course you'll be able to accurately place 4-7 rounds in less than 1 sec... .18 second splitsare common... That'd be 333 rounds a minute... if your clip was big enough!

This seems to make a LOT of sense to me. Especially useful for clearing a house, as you can use EITHER HAND, and especially beneficial to those with "opposite eye dominance" (i.e. Right handed-left eye dominant).

The stances are a whole lot different than Weaver and modified Weaver. And they warn you that trying to "get it" from the videos and photos might lead to bad habits...

That said, here are some links to action vids.

Fast shootin' from 2 "positions"

The following group was shot from the 2nd "position" seen above (where the gun is away from his chest):
Fast shootin' group

This is the measurements and split times for the group shot above
Still from the Fast Shootin' group

This is a video from the shooters point of view of:

And finally; a video of the inventor of the C.A.R. system showing some of the basics... note the hand change speed and the mag change speed late in the vid:
Introduction

Last of all: Links to the home pages of both C.A.R. (for LE/MIL)
And IPD Systems (For us regular folks)
C.A.R.:
Sabre Tactical

IPD Systems:
IPD Systems

Both offer on-line courses that give you a discount on the attended class.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
19,454 Posts
the CAR system is mostly about very close up shooting (inside arm lengths in some instances) through instinctual hold of the gun instead of use of sights (for the most part). it requires ALOT of practice that can be dangerous at times, and with teh current cost of ammo, expensive to learn.

there is a place for close up training but it must be done with care and attention to detail. after your slide smacks you in teh face during a drawback drill you tend to learn some hard lessons.

i feel the best shooting school is going to teh range and shooting, shooting, shooting, instead of taking classes and listening to instructors. they have thier place, but most shooting schools use classroom time in place of range time for various reasons and i dont approve of that. shooting school should take place 100% on the range, and if something needs discussed, the students take a knee and you discuss.

SW
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Since one of the requirements for their class is to bring 800 rounds of ammunition for your weapon... I hardly think they're going to spend a lot of time in the classroom?

Sights are used, as nearly as I can tell, in their "extended" and "apogee" positions. While the "high" position is used in the close in (5-8') range.

While I'll agree that a lot of time and ammo needs to be spent at the range, as you say, I also believe that classroom time discussing what really happens to you (physiologically) in a real encounter is important to learn in the classroom, unless you are doing live fire excercises (I think that's pretty rare even in the military).

Most of us have not encountered the "tunnel vision" or the other changes that occur in a "close encounter" as you(?) and I have.

Most of us don't practice using our weapons in simulated scenarios around the house unloaded or at the range.

All gun handling is learned, it is not full of natural actions. Being taught the basics, and the reasons behind them, and practicing those basics constantly is critical to being able to defend one's self in a critical situation.

Just my thoughts. I appreciate yours and look forward to others input as well.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
19,454 Posts
i can burn 800 rounds in less than an hour of SD drills if im doing rapid fire drills. 800 rounds isnt much. if im doing a full weekend of SD shooting for myself i can burn 1500 rounds a day easy. if im training someone else it multiplies.

SW
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
367 Posts
1500 rounds a day? man I need to get into reloading. I feel guilty if I shoot 50 rounds of .45acp a day out shooting. Pretty much I practice my skills with a 22 anymore and just shoot just enough to stay used to a gun. I think I've shot barly 50 rounds thru my LCP and I've had it since jan...
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
also, as far as instinctual shooting without the sights... I was able to put all 13 rounds from a new (to me) CZvz 82 onto a letter sized sheet target at 10 yards from the high position. No sights... Now, admittedly the groups weren't 2" but I did keep them all on the sheet, without sights. Enough C.O.M. shots to put down a
BG? I think so.

I think, for someone new ts shooting/handling a firearm...especially a handgun, that the "ergonomic" methods taught in the IPD/C.A.R. make some sense.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,279 Posts
I just wish it was offered in my area... Are there any similar techniques I might be able to learn in the midwest?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
120 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
nearest to the midwest seems to be Michigan... :(

I too would like to find one near me.
 
1 - 8 of 8 Posts
Top