***Range Report*** What do you think causes this...

Discussion in 'Gun Reviews and Range Reports' started by Dagwood, Apr 21, 2015.

  1. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    I took the model 1896 mauser to the range again today. Left some crazy ragged wholes in the paper.
    It's like the bullet's are tumbling thru the air. The ammo is old milsurp stuff. The question is;
    Could this be caused by the ammo, or the barrel being cut down to 18 1/4"? Maybe the barrel is "shot out".
    I'm curious what you guys think.
     
  2. Think1st

    Think1st Supporting Member

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    Your bullets definitely aren't being stabilized properly. You could have worn out rifling, bullets' weights that aren't matched properly with the rate of twist, or you may need to recrown the muzzle where you cut the barrel down.
     

  3. talon

    talon the banned wagon

    See above. Something is definitely causing the bullet to tumble drastically. Id say a rough spot where you cut the barrel could be snagging it just enough to cause it. Can you see any lead shavings when you look into the barrel?
    Its not very likely the ammo itself i don't think.
     
  4. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    Thanks t1st.
    I didn't cut this barrel down, I just bought this rifle. The barrel was in rough shape when i got it.
    I have been cleaning it pretty much daily for a week or so.
    Today when I got home I boiled water and used dawn dish soap and a bore brush and scrubbed the barrel. This is the same method I use on my other mausers after shooting corrosive ammo. It came out looking pretty good.
    I think I need to try some new mfg ammo before i can really make an informed determination as to what might be the cause.
     
  5. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    I will try to take a pic down the bore to show you all the condition.
    I believe the barrel is original, aside from it being cut down. The crown actually looks very good.
    i think this rifle was sporterized like this a long time ago.
     
  6. ajole

    ajole Supporting Member

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    Are you certain it's 7 mm?

    8 mm chambers can, sometimes, chamber and fire 7 mm bullets.
     
  7. talon

    talon the banned wagon

    I can see how this could be a possibility, but i would think there would be enough pressure drop to significantly lower the distance and force of the expelled round. Almost like duds or weak loads. That you would likely be able to notice and feel that the rounds were not exciting properly. No?
     
  8. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    The barrel id is noticeably smaller than my 8mm's. I dint think that is it.
    The pawn shop mic'd it at 7.2 or something.
     
  9. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    I might have to take it in to my smitty and get it checked out.
     
  10. planosteve

    planosteve Lifetime Supporter

    Slug the bore or have a gun smith check it.
     
  11. histed

    histed Supporting Member

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    You're shooting copper jackets, right? You said the bore was rough - try some premium copper solvent, then Hoppe's lead remover. Some of these older rifles have crud in the bore that Dawn isn't going to touch. Back in teh day we used mercury, bit I could do 20 in Leavenworth for just mentioning that today - especially in the commie states
     
  12. I have got good accuracy with some pretty rough rifling. I suspect the cut is not square, or a bad crown. I am not sure what the cost would be to have a smith redo your barrel. But you can do it yourself with the proper size pilot rod. Drill stock for the pilot is not expensive, you just need to find the right diameter.
     
  13. FlashBang

    FlashBang I Stand With Talon Lifetime Supporter

    Dagwood... your rounds are doing what is called "key holing" the round is hitting the target while it is sideways in its tumble. This is seen a lot when developing subsonic rounds, and the first thing I would ask is what grain bullet are you shooting? The second question is have you 100% confirmed the caliber?

    The target clearly indicates that the rounds are not stabilized.

    .
     
  14. planosteve

    planosteve Lifetime Supporter

    Have your bullets been drinking or have they taken a trip to Colorado lately?
     
  15. Likely it is a worn out barrel. Most the rifles used by the Boers went thru heck in that war. For most of it, the Boers were on the move continuously, living outdoors, etc. Think corrosive primers and not being able to clean the rifle right away. Also, the number of rounds fired was high.

    If you've ever seen a Boer rifle or pictures of one that used by the Bitterender's or even a picture of a Bitterender(dressed in rags and covered in boils) when he surrendered, you'll better understand.

    If you want to get to work a little better- clean the barrel with a Foul Out & shoot a cast bullet. You should then get a good enough group for a few rounds. You might want to consider lapping the barrel.

    FWIW & IMO - if the barrel is worn out, I'd just leave it as is and keep it as a true collectible as opposed to being just one of 'my bunch of rifles'. You have one of the few truly historical mil surplus rifles that is floating around. I only have a couple of them, the rest are just in the 'an old army rifle' category.
     
  16. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    These are the best pic's I can get. It's a lot better than it was when i got it.
     
  17. SWAGA

    SWAGA No longer broke... Lifetime Supporter

    I'm still going with wrong caliber.
    Has it been rebarreled into something similar but not the same?
    I refuse to believe that cutting a barrel from 22-24 inches to 18 will cause that.
     
  18. Think1st

    Think1st Supporting Member

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    There certainly is distinct rifling in there. If the caliber being wrong isn't the cause (not enough evidence for me to be sure about that), then you should have the crown checked by a gun Smith.
     
  19. ajole

    ajole Supporting Member

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    That barrel doesn't look too bad, IMHO.

    Easy check, put a bullet in the muzzle, if it doesn't get swallowed whole, you are ok on caliber.;)

    I'm thinking its a bad crown, but I'm just guessing, can't see the muzzle in the pics.
     
  20. Dagwood

    Dagwood Supporting Member

    Heres the muzzle, and the 7mm seems right to me. I think i'll try some new prvi ammo or something and see what happens.