Should I? Trade a carbine upper for a midlength upper?

1035 Views 32 Replies 4 Participants Last post by CamoDeafie, 2 mo ago

CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · 3 mo ago

Now, I've had this Sarco special M4-clone 16" AR for a while.... .223 Wylde; parkerized grayish barrel coating, 1:9 twist, pinned FSB, carbine gas length with skinny carbine handguards... the thing is though, the stock is a M4 Clone from likely UTG or some other brand, since when I got the kit, the stock, buffer, spring and tube were in a bag with a "Made In china" sticker.. unlike the rest of the parts.

I've a hankering to do something similar to the Colt MT6731 Match Target carbine with an A2 stock, but seeing photos of the midlength gas 16" uppers with A1 and A2 stocks really make them look awesome... so I'm looking at possibly trading or just sell this upper without BCG/CH and carry handle, and acquire a 16" midlength upper with FSB....

Air gun Trigger Gun barrel Gun accessory Machine gun

Colt MT6731 with Heavy Barrel, available from 1997-2012ish?

What I have

Camouflage Military camouflage Machine gun Air gun Trigger

At the top above the 12" Grendel with 3d printed blade brace

Revolver Musical instrument Everyday carry Air gun Shotgun

On the left, obviously

What I kinda liking...

Air gun Trigger Machine gun Gun barrel Gun accessory

Not mine, found on Google, I don't own a glock 🤣

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #21 · 2 mo ago

This seems... unbalanced. Edit. It feels OK, they didn't include a countersunk bolt for running the stock without the pad, just a bigass Allen socket head bolt which is for counterbored holes.

Air gun Trigger Shotgun Machine gun Gun barrel

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undeRGRound

· #22 · 2 mo ago

CamoDeafie said:
This seems... unbalanced. Edit. It feels OK, they didn't include a countersunk bolt for running the stock without the pad, just a bigass Allen socket head bolt which is for counterbored holes.

View attachment 77886

Thought u wanted the shorter L.O.P. entry stock 😹

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #23 · 2 mo ago

undeRGRound said:
Thought u wanted the shorter L.O.P. entry stock 😹

Well I couldn't find one for under $110 shipped

But.. okay. M4 fully extended on the SBR lower is same length.

M4 fully in is "Entry" length, 3.5 inches difference if account for the rubber pad on skeleton stock

Trigger Air gun Wood Machine gun Gun barrel

Lengths I'd be OK with if they existed at all, either in retro AR fixed stock or in skeleton stock but not the Magpul/aftermarket fixed carbine stocks that doesn't look as clean and simple as the Ace skeleton I like, or as old school as the A1/A2 stocks. There is the Rock River Arms Entry fixed stock which I think is between the shortest M4 configuration and the next shortest.

2" shorter with pad, 1.5" shorter without pad

1.5" shorter with pad, roughly 1" shorter without pad.

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #24 · 2 mo ago

With the Ace skeleton stock having the lower bar being pinned to the two cast &machined end pieces; if I could find a buffer tube of the correct outside diameter and a length that I like; could cut the lower bar at the front, and then pin again, and have a custom length skeleton stock. Other option is to get the tube length I want, and then the Entry stock, and then a spacer and castle nut and endplate. But that's not as clean as I'd like. A cut-down a1 or A2 stock could in theory work, if I could get a butt plate to fit, or if I could figure the retainer portion at the front.

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undeRGRound

· #25 · 2 mo ago

Keep after it, you'll get it perfect!!

I used to modify engine parts, and this stuff is clearly easier and less P.I.T.A. to make it work properly

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #26 · 2 mo ago

undeRGRound said:
Keep after it, you'll get it perfect!!

I used to modify engine parts, and this stuff is clearly easier and less P.I.T.A. to make it work properly

Oh, it would be stupid easy to have a machine shop where I can turn tubes down and mod away without having to pay other people for the work

but I'd still have to pay for the tooling and materials..although, it could be a good gig on the side. One option I could see being useful... is a metal or even plastic tube extender spacer that goes between the end of the pistol tube and the end block of the skeleton stock but.... some carbine length pistol tubes don't even have a hole to tap. So that goes back to cutting down an A1/A2 tube. Or finding a pistol extended tube.

Edit..it's similar to how we ended up having midlength gas systems. Someone in a barrel machine shop decided a mid length would solve overgassing problems with 16" barrels and bring the bayonet lug to the right location relative to muzzle..and here we are.

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #27 · 2 mo ago

The simplest route is probably to find a maker space and 3d-print a 1"-1.5" buttpad spacer to go on the Entry stock assembly... might look a bit.. odd but it's probably the simplest way to goo?

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undeRGRound

· #28 · 2 mo ago

CamoDeafie said:
The simplest route is probably to find a maker space and 3d-print a 1"-1.5" buttpad spacer to go on the Entry stock assembly... might look a bit.. odd but it's probably the simplest way to goo?

I thought you wanted tube extension, which would look OEM.
I've seen nearly the same size OD spacers, 0.250" thick, with a 0.250" hole. Like fat Life Savers candy.
I save stuff like that for "conversions". I'm sure you could make something like that work as a tube extension to any desired length. But now it seems you have different plans...

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #29 · 2 mo ago

Right but; I'm wanting extend it by 1.5-2 inches from Entry length. Cleanest would be cut lower bar, get extended tube, cut down A1 tube or custom tube machined to desired specs... simplest would be a buttplate spacer/extension of the right size and shape; but it might not look as clean and simple a I'd like to.

A 3d printed "chopped" A1 stock that can use a modified carbine buffer tube or modified extended pistol tube might also work pretty good.

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #30 · 2 mo ago

But anyways... I still think a 16" midlength upper with pinned FSB would look more balanced with the Ace skeleton stock....

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undeRGRound

· #31 · 2 mo ago

Dissapator Upper 🎯

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ajole

· #32 · 2 mo ago

I still can’t figure out if you want a look, or a feel, or what exactly.

I have a faux Dissipator upper, mid gassed, looks sort of like a Commando with a carbine lower, or sort of like a Dissipator on an A1 rifle lower.
I’m not concerned about details like the “right“ muzzle brake or flash hider, or the forward assist or it’s shape.

Shoots good either way.

I also have my newest toy, the ultralight A1 stocked, 16” length, carbine gassed weapon, which is balanced really well, and also shoots good.

I dont like the “Entry” stocks’ looks at all, but I’ve never held one, maybe it feels great.

IMHO, I prefer the A1 stocks. I don’t play with armor, I don’t need a shorter LOP, and I almost always open my adjustable carbine stocks to the next to longest setting anyway.
I have a few A2 stocks…good for target shooting with a properly set up scope, and not much else, based on my 5’8” body proportions. Taller guys should and probably do feel different about that.

And I have no idea about the exact LOP on the many and various options out there. I think, in the end, you just try them out and decide if you like them or not.

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CamoDeafie

Discussion Starter · #33 · 2 mo ago

Both look n feel, and price. I tend to run the m4 stock at the two midpoint positions, which is shorter than A1. But I hate all the way in, so that eliminate entry stocks.

I do like the look of the Midlength 16" FSB uppers moreso than the carbine gassed one which looks a bit... overly long ahead of the FSB .. though it shoots reliably, it is a bit overgassed with the standard carbine buffer. I should see how it shoots with the rifle buffer and skeleton stock first and then see from there.

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