Stupid question about recoil

Discussion in 'General Firearms Discussion' started by Back2School, Feb 10, 2015.

  1. Back2School

    Back2School Member

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    Ok, I need some advice. I picked up a 9mm Shield yesterday as my new primary CCW gun. Shot it last night. Either I am a wimp, I have a bad grip or I am using overly hot loads but that thing had more of a bite than I was expecting. I am a firm believer in practicing with what I carry so that means every other week at the range and I would like less recoil. Or I will end up practicing less. I am accurate with it, but when I was done shooting, my hand hurt for awhile.

    I had Freedom munitions 115 GR ammo. Didnt think this was overly hot and shot fine out of my C9. I know the smaller framed pistol is to blame, but it was a major difference to me. I read where some suggest going to 147 grain to reduce recoil or even a specialty ammo like Winchester W Train and Defend - but that stuff is $$$$.

    Maybe I just need to suck it up and get used to dealing with something with a kick again. Its just those ugly heavy Hi Points have me spoiled and comfortable - low recoil with that big ugly slide. Hi Point = Cadillac of the firearm world? LOL.

    Any suggestions? Or just accept it as it is for CCW only with limited range duty and practice with my others?
     
  2. you might have to suck this one up. either get a heavier pistol, or shoot smaller rounds. I shot Shield last week end that my friend bought very nice pistol. But his was a .40cal and i say very very snappy. But i expected that in a 19oz .40Cal
     

  3. USMC_VET

    USMC_VET Supporting Member

  4. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    Yeah. Let's go shooting together soon. I'll let you run a box through my RAMOM P64. Then when you shoot your Shield you'll go, "Daaang, this is a light and comfortable shooter!" ;)

    But if that don't work for you, maybe a Hogue or Packmayr type slip on grip or maybe a pair of shooting gloves.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  5. Is it worse than a PF9? i hear they are murder on your palms.

    My buddy actually had his Shield .40 flip out of his hand once. I really think that .40 is to big for that little gun, and he should buy a 9mm barrel if he cant hold on. But it sounds like the 9 might be a ***** too?
     
  6. Branth

    Branth Member

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    I'd be leery of reduced recoil springs just on general principle. I've never tried them, so take it with a grain of salt, but I'd be afraid of reliability issues with different ammo. They designed the gun to run with a certain weight of spring that factors in the slide and barrel weight and a wide range of factory ammo, and it seems to me an extra-strength recoil spring could give you short-cycle issues with lighter loads.

    Small 9mm guns are tough to shoot well. I've got a Taurus 709, and it's a bit of a beast. I'd practice on a good, firm, two-handed grip and that can actually tame the perceived recoil somewhat.
     
  7. beaglenc

    beaglenc Member

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    There is a huge difference in the feel of a "service" weight handgun and many "carry" weight handguns.
    A standard 1911 weighs 2.5 #'s +/-. Shoot that same round(45) out of,,,say a Kahr CM45 at 17 oz and we have a big difference.
    You'll get used to the recoil. If it is hurting you, look to see if you can do something with the grip, a sleave maybe from Hogue? A glove for the range for when you are putting out way more rounds than "when you really need it".
    My carry single stack nine weighs 23 and I like that little extra weight. When you start getting down into 9's, 40's and 45's that weigh less than 20oz, 30 rnds or so at the range is all that I need to do with those guns. It's for close up and personal. Break out the ones with weight when you want to refine yer skills and enjoy shooting.
    2 cents.
     
  8. Back2School

    Back2School Member

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    Honestly, its me and not the gun. I have only shot 1 subcompact before and that was a 380.

    All I can say was I was at a class and they wanted us to go through a box. I hit everything I needed to, they moved my target out further and I still hit so I didnt finish my 50 rounds. I felt it even after I got home. Like I said, I must be a wimp, because it was not enjoyable :(

    I just want to find a way to have fun shooting this one and I figured who better to ask? This forum has more knowledge than any I have been on.
     
  9. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    The felt recoil on a PF9 is pretty stiff but I've grown accustom to it. The felt recoil on a P64 is twice that of the PF9. They call it "The Polish Pounder" for a reason. ;) One guy I let shoot my P64, a RSO at a local range, compared it to an alloy framed .357 snub. The other RSO I let shoot it that day refused to shoot more than one round. He put it down and wouldn't touch it again.

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  10. Liberty

    Liberty Shhh! Lifetime Supporter

    Switch back to a C9.
     
  11. USMC_VET

    USMC_VET Supporting Member


    i've run both 115grain and 147 grain FMJ thru my S&W SD9 and it works very well with the 20lbs Galloway spring plus it eliminates the factory plastic guide rod for a metal one . the factory spring rate for my S&W SD 9 is only 17lbs so 3lbs more isn't noticeable at all
     
  12. That sounds terrible...
     
  13. I shouldn't say there are no other options. There are as have been mentioned.
    If you have big hands grab a squishy grip sleeve.
    Recoil spring will help also, but dont go to heavy, and make sure you test it A LOT if this is your CCW.

    Like i said i think the shield is a great gun, cant go wrong with it. But sometimes we men are a little more wimpy then we realize :p

    I hate shooting any rifle bigger than a .308. I just do. Its fun, it booms, but i don't need that to feel like i'm having fun. Throw me a 22 and a metal reactive target, ill plink all day
     
  14. Back2School

    Back2School Member

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    So does subsonic ammo make a difference? Or the heavier grain bullets? I was hoping to hear a yay or nay in addition to the other suggestions.
     
  15. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    Especially for what amounts to .380ACP +P++ performance (or sub-9mm).

    But the gun is beautiful. Well executed. Nice bluing. Highly accurate. Super light SA trigger (don't get me started on the DA trigger, however).

    The gun has a lot going for it, but "felt recoil" ain't one of those things. :)

    Peace favor your sword,
    Kirk
     
  16. SWAGA

    SWAGA No longer broke... Lifetime Supporter

    Practice what you carry yeah but I'm also of the school of thought that a lot of carry guns are not shooting guns.
    You carry them to save your life and frankly who cares if your hand hurts after you've emptied a mag in a raving madman.

    I carry a pocket .380 and honestly I've shot it three times in two years.
    In a training environment I can shoot a torso at 30 feet.
    But I doubt I'd ever shoot it over 10 feet maybe? It's a last resort weapon.

    I have no personal experience with any of then but I've been told a lot of the small pocket pistols and aluminum frame snub nose are brutal to shoot.
     
  17. Heavier bullets pushed at the same pressure should have more recoil. Remember that recoil is the reaction to pushing a particular weight at a certain speed. The more weight, or speed, the more recoil.

    1911's generally have low recoil for the weight of the round, but the guns are heavy, and the pressure is lower. Pocket guns are not meant to be fun guns, they are highly concealable guns to save your life. In an adrenalin rush you probably would never feel the recoil. It is like getting punched in a fist fight, depending on how mad or scared you are the punch sometimes is not felt.

    IMO people don't need to shoot thousands of rounds to become a very good shot. It is about technique more than anything, and that can be learned with a pellet gun or a 22lr. IMO, and it will save you money, get a airsoft shield clone, go have a ball. Shoot your shield just enough to keep you aware of the feel of it. If you get to the point of wincing from expectation of stinging recoil you may have difficulty hitting your target in the future.

    [ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uuMEAND3Dw"]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uuMEAND3Dw[/ame]
     
  18. mn_doggie

    mn_doggie Member

    2,124
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    MN
    I've fired the Shield before and it does have some recoil. Nowhere near what the smaller Diamondback has or the PF9. Both of those are lighter weight and the grip area is smaller so the pressure on your hand is greater.

    Even my little LCP .380 is worse than the Shield.

    I know people suggest changing springs but all that does is make it harder to rack the slide.

    Just think of the physics involved. The 9mm round has roughly 330 ft lbs of muzzle energy. Changing the spring from 16 to 20 lbs is still pretty insignificant compared to the 330 ft lbs. The round to round variation in manufacture of the ammo may give you that much difference.
     
  19. bluharley

    bluharley Member

    I'm waiting on my Kahr CM40, 15oz gun throwing a .40 caliber, I'm expecting a big bite. Not a range gun, but a big bang for the buck and in a pickle, it will work. And BTW SWAGA, they make them in a .45 too! Just sayin.
     
  20. :eek: Expect a helmet to... IM just saying :p