Trying to decide whether to get C&R

Discussion in 'Curio & Relic Zone' started by mr_flintstone, Oct 28, 2015.

  1. mr_flintstone

    mr_flintstone Supporting Member

    I've been trying to decide for a while now whether or not to get a C&R license. I know the benefits of having one, but are there any drawbacks? Do you have to keep an A&D record? Does the ATF have to come inspect? Anything else like this that might be a hassle.
  2. ajole

    ajole Supporting Member

    NE Utah
    ATF visits are EXTREMELY rare, I've heard of maybe 2...and that was guys that buy 75-100 guns a year.

    There is a requirement to use a "bound book" record, but IIRC, it's only of the guns you USE the C&R for....but that may not be correct.

    I seriously don't know of ANYONE that wishes they hadn't got one.

  3. moona11

    moona11 King of you Monkeys Lifetime Supporter

    If think any gun that qualified as a C&R needs to be in the book after you get a C&R even if you didn't use it to buy a gun. I could look it up but Flash will be along to answer it.
  4. rickm

    rickm Member

    I have a C&R but the reason i first got it was most of the places(midway,brownell's,Cabelas) gave you a discount when you made orders but most of them dont do that anymore but like when you order powder most places wants some form of ID for proof of age so you can use it for that, but as far as using it to buy guns with have never done it most of the time my LGS gives me enough of a good bargain i just buy from him without using the C&R.
  5. FlashBang

    FlashBang I Stand With Talon Lifetime Supporter

    When you have a C&R FFL you must maintain a "Bound Book", which is a record of all C&R firearms purchased using your C&R FFL. Once you have your C&R, any firearm purchased that qualifies as a C&R must be recorded in the Bound Book regardless of whether you used the C&R to buy it or not. Any C&R firearm that you subsequently sell must also be recorded in the Bound Book. The BATFE has the right to inspect your Bound Book and inventory your C&R firearms at anytime during the course of your license validity. However, the BATFE must make an appointment with you to do the inspection and you have the right to either allow it at your licensed address or to take all records and firearms to their office. I only know of one person who was ever audited. Every three years when(if) you renew your FFL you must complete a BATFE form providing a count of how many firearms you purchased and how many you sold during the preceding three year period.

    The prices of C&R firearms are higher then they used to be, but there are still deals to be had out there. You will also get discounts from several vendors with your C&R FFL. The discounts can add up quickly and recover the $30 cost of the license by themselves.

    The biggest drawback is that it makes buying C&R firearms so easy. You always find something that you 'have' to have. :)

    If you keep good records, follow the BATFE regulations and don't think you can use it to buy and sell as a business, you'll be fine.

    As for getting audited for buying over a certain amount in a three year period.... they have never batted an eye about how many I buy. ;)

  6. moona11

    moona11 King of you Monkeys Lifetime Supporter

  7. mr_flintstone

    mr_flintstone Supporting Member

    Good to know guys. Thanks for the info. I think I'll fill out the paperwork and send it in.
  8. lklawson

    lklawson Staff Member

    Subsequent to the issuance of the license or does it include adding C&R eligible firearms already in your collection?

    I would find it irksome to get a C&R License for discounts on powder or whathaveyou and then be required to immediately start making entries to the Bound Book of firearms I've had for years already.

    Peace favor your sword,
  9. moona11

    moona11 King of you Monkeys Lifetime Supporter

    I do not believe you need to but Flash can answer it. I'm on my phone.
  10. FlashBang

    FlashBang I Stand With Talon Lifetime Supporter

    C&R firearms that are owned prior to obtaining your C&R FFL do not have to be entered into the Bound Book or recorded into the Bound Book when sold per the C&R regulations.

    Can you possibly have an issue proving what you had prior to obtaining your FFL and what you got after obtaining it? Yes.

    There are two ways to handle this.

    #1 - Have a Bound Book for non-C&R firearms that shows the acquisition information of the firearm in question. You can use an electronic version for this and include pictures etc. This is always a good idea to have should a firearm be stolen or a fire occurs and you need an inventory for Insurance.

    #2 - Record them in your Bound Book and list it as "Obtained prior to license"; and if sold do the same for the sale instead of recording the purchasers info.

    When (if) you renew your license you do not have to count them as A or D for the renewal, only the ones you bought or sold after obtaining the license.

    *Note: If you purchase a firearm that is classified as an antique, you do not need to record the purchase or sale of it in your Bound Book.

  11. bscar

    bscar Supporting Member

    FB is spot on with what the lawyer I talked to about it said.
    I made an appointment with a firearms lawyer to ask him the same questions you asked, and more. Figured a consultation was cheaper than a retainer. He said he dud have 1 case where a guy sold too many C&R guns for the ATF's liking, but the owner didn't know about the "limit" for sales.
  12. FlashBang

    FlashBang I Stand With Talon Lifetime Supporter

    There is no "limit" for how many you can sell. It is an arbitrary number based solely on BATFE interpretation of what constitutes being "in the business" and selling for profit versus selling "to enhance" your collection. If you buy 50 firearms and sell 45 of them, you will get a visit. ;)